Mindfully Masculine: Personal Growth and Mental Health for Men
Charles and Dan are just two guys talking about relationships, masculinity, and authenticity. Join them as they discuss books and media, as well as their (sometimes messy) personal stories, to encourage men to join the fight for their mental, physical, and emotional health--because a world of healthy, resilient men is a thriving and more secure world for everyone.
Mindfully Masculine: Personal Growth and Mental Health for Men
Eating, Breathing, Sleeping, Pooping
Have you ever sipped on a green juice and wondered if it's truly the elixir of health? Strap in, as we dissect fasting and detoxes with raw honesty, sharing not just our own roller coaster experiences, but the hard-hitting skepticism that surrounds them. We engage in a vibrant discussion about the allure of quick health fixes, from the energizing highs of fasting to the often-debated efficacy of detox regimes. Get ready for a candid exploration of personal anecdotes, the impact of natural cycles on sleep, and whether the feel-good factor is due to toxin eviction or the body's innate responses.
Juice cleanses - they're not just for the health zealots. Join us as we recall the trials of subsisting on liquid nourishment, inspired by tales of transformation and an undeniable curiosity. We unravel the narrative of choosing berries over burgers and the tug-of-war with persistent cravings. Beware of the post-cleanse world; we confront the challenge of sustaining weight loss and the reality of reverting to our processed food paramours. Our journey through dietary revelations doesn't end with the last sip; we share the organic denouement of our juice journey, spilling insights on health and well-being.
But there's more to our well-being than what we consume and expel. We weave into the critical conversation the underestimated champion of health—sleep. We share insider secrets to achieving that perfect slumber, from bone broth fasts to the balance of electrolytes. Hear personal tales about sleep environments and the surprising accessories that might just revolutionize your night. We round off our chat with a foray into the impacts of breathing techniques on sleep, the social stigmas surrounding mouth breathing, and the ever-present challenge of hearing loss in our families. All this, plus a quirky nod to the unconventional ways one might profit from nature's call!
Hey Charles, how are you?
Charles:They do a great hour you are well. What's new since last time we talked?
Dan:I am 43 hours into my fast.
Charles:God help you. Yeah, just it gets easier, though. Is it just liquid, right? Yeah, oof, ok, but how's it going?
Dan:Warm liquid. Yeah, a lot of caffeine. Yeah, um, first day was rough. Did not sleep well last night. Um, could have been from the caffeine stimulants, or it could have been from stomach grumbling, but I have a lot more energy and alertness today than I normally do when I'm not fasting. In a weird way, now, that also does happen to me this time of month, Based on your menstrual cycle, based on my, based on my menstrual cycle and based on the lunar cycle, actually, because we're having a full moon on the 26th, and so a couple of days before and a couple of days afterwards, I'm a light sleeper. I don't sleep much, but I'm also not as tired. It's weird. I'm not sleeping deep at all, but during the day I'm waking up and I'm a little groggy when I wake up. But I have a pretty good day, full of energy, usually Interesting. Yeah, it's, I'm weird, I don't know. So you just the camera here for just a second. Yeah, I think I bumped it. Oh, ok, there we go.
Charles:OK, there we go, all right. There now everybody can see you mostly sitting in the center of the frame.
Dan:There we go Nice.
Charles:Yeah, fasting man. We're going to talk about detoxes and fasts and stuff and they certainly it is an effective way to drop some LBs, especially water weight, for sure.
Dan:Yeah.
Charles:And I just don't like it's crazy how many times I've tried to fast and like I will have ordered my meal through the drive through and like be between windows when I remember, oh, I'm fasting, Wow, and like I'll just it'll complete, I'll just go on full autopilot and order food and be like fudge. I guess I'm going to drink this Diet Coke but the rest of us go straight in the garbage. Oh, you can't give. I mean McDonald's is like oh, we'll take it back. Yeah, you know. It's just like. Yeah, I've done that before. I've had to throw away a big Mac and large fry because I forgot that I was fasting. I was just zoned out completely.
Dan:Holy cow. Yeah, that's interesting.
Charles:Yeah, it's probably you know, whatever Pryon or Paramecium, or eat my brain, that part of it just checks out. But all right, so let's, since you're, since you're fasting, we'll jump right into the topic of detoxing. Sounds good, which I did a little bit of research on this one too. Okay, and here's the problem that most experts have with the idea of detoxing Uh, the kind of detoxing, the kind of toxins that detoxing rinse your body of. There is no way you test your body and say this is your toxin count now. Yeah, and now you've detoxed for a week, so your toxin count has gone lower.
Charles:So it's what we call an unfalsifiable claim that detoxing really does anything. It's like, uh, in the example that I I looked up one on trying to explain an unfalsifiable claim, it's something Jesus said, actually, which is, you know, the idea that faith can move mountains. Well, I have a lot of faith and I've tried to move them out and it doesn't work. And then the response is well, you don't have enough faith, so it's, it's. It's one of those Like there's no logical way to disprove someone's position, you can't, there's no evidence that you could offer that would say, okay, here's how I know for a fact that what you've said is right or wrong. Yeah, and so, um, just know that that's the spirit of skepticism that I'm bringing to this chapter.
Dan:Yeah, no, I get it. Um, and my impression as well is really it's very subjective. So, for example, a lot of the symptoms that they list in the book and that I'm familiar with when it comes to you know, the reason why you'd want to detox are kind of related to immune, immune system issues, where you might be catching cold a little bit more often. Maybe your allergies are acting up. I mean, who's to say what's causing that?
Charles:right, Because isolating variables is definitely difficult in a complex system like the human body, oh for sure.
Dan:So you know, I think those are mostly the reasons why people might try a detox, because, hey, you know, maybe the cold medicine isn't working, the allergy medicine isn't working, um, or not as much, or maybe they're just they seem to, for whatever reason. Again, this is all subjective, unless you're going to put somebody in a you know some sort of scientific study or whatever to measure them 24 hours a day?
Charles:or you're long when they don't get to self-report their experience.
Dan:Yeah, and anytime anybody's self-reporting forget that, yeah. But you know, I think that's why a lot of people end up doing these detoxes, is they just not? They're feeling down and they're best, they're willing to try it. You know, and that's the thing is, you don't know, like on this fast, what happens is I mean, there's scientific evidence that shows that you know when you are fasting and you start to create ketones. It does actually offer some clarity with your brain and everything else like that.
Dan:So they might be feeling better from that, and not necessarily because they got rid of all the toxins right. So who knows why they're feeling better? Yeah, it's just, and you'll usually feel worse. All these methods, most of the time you're going to feel worse at the beginning.
Charles:Exactly, and yeah, there's. It's just it's clear that you know when you're, when you're reading the work of someone who is not a scientific journalist.
Charles:and I mean he says A lot of like may feel or could toxins could come from anywhere, well then they could also come from nowhere. Yeah, you know you can't have one without the other. Yeah, it'll say the idea is that your body can build up reserves of all sorts of toxins that affect how well you function, like the idea is. So it's an idea, it's not a theory. There's because there's no way to test it really.
Dan:So that, and that's unbelievable to me that there's no way to test this stuff, like I mean, I'm not questioning that there is, there is, but I just I feel like we can test for a lot of stuff and if this is a prevalent thing to where it's like affecting your immune system, we should be able to figure out how to test for Right.
Charles:It's just what we're going to call a toxin. That's the thing is. Is leadotoxin? Is mercury toxin? Yeah, we can test for those things and they put people in the ground when they get into their bodies. But the kind of toxins that you get from pollution and processed food, I mean some of those could just be bad vibes and we don't have a test for those yet.
Dan:There's no, there's got to be specific chemicals.
Charles:that yeah, it's like. What molecules are we talking about? That's what I want to know.
Dan:Like a secondhand smoke from you know, from you know, or, like you know, sitting by campfire and inhaling all that, the smoke from that, or eating the charred pieces off of like a burnt you know burnt piece of barbecue burger or whatever. Yeah, there's definitely chemicals in there and it's. I mean. Yeah, maybe once it's in the body it's hard to find. I don't know, maybe we didn't do our work to see if we could find a test for that.
Charles:Well, I did. I did read that. You know, a lot of health authorities in various countries are like okay, don't, this is a way for people to sell things, products and services. This is not a again without being able to say here's the baseline, here's where you are right now, you've gone through this, this procedure or this process and now something's changed.
Dan:Yeah, now you're somewhere else. Yeah, then, yeah, it's difficult to.
Charles:It's very difficult. And so you know, I'm not sure if you can tell me what you're doing with the, the acupuncture. At least with that you've got people that can report. Here's how I felt before, right. And then I went through the study where they either did sham acupuncture, they did a real acupuncture, and now I feel this way afterward with, with these detoxes, all you have is somebody saying, yeah, you would almost have to do some sort of a, a blind study, where it's like, but how, how do you, how do you trick someone into thinking that they're detoxing when they're not actually detoxing? They're easy to pull off.
Charles:Yeah, but he suggested you know, maybe you have chronic headaches, maybe you find that it's harder to get through your regular workouts, Maybe your allergies are a little bit worse. And then the answer is, well, maybe a detox will fix it. It's like, okay, well, maybe maybe killing your firstborn son on an altar will fix it too. But science doesn't have a lot to offer, not everyone. So it says. You know, before you start a cleanse you should go to your doctor. But keep in mind that not everybody's a fan of cleanses. So your doctor might say this is stupid, don't do it.
Dan:And then in that case, it's interesting he never mentions like if he's done a cleanse, or that's true, yes, Exactly Wonder.
Charles:Listen to what people who hate cleanses have to say with an open mind, meaning don't necessarily believe them. And that's part of the thing that bums me out about the you know, and a topic I've talked about before on the show, which is the death of expertise in this country. Like we no longer believe that any person with a bunch of letters after their name and a bunch of years in their field of study, their opinion is no more valid than my opinion, and I did my own research. It's like, yeah, but you probably don't know how to do research Fair. I mean, research is also a thing that you study and get good at, and there are people who are good at research or people who are not good at research.
Dan:Yeah, I mean it's a complicated process to basically I mean to even read a study and it's we had a whole semester on that in college In a naked form is not easy.
Dan:No, and we had like a whole semester in college where the class was dedicated on how to read scientific studies was not straightforward, you know. I mean, there's some obvious stuff if there's a conflict of interest and stuff like that, but sometimes that's not even listed there and you have to dig to find out who funded the study. So, yeah, and then again you need to know statistics. And is this significant and statistically significant, these results? And then a lot of times, the interpretation of the results from the doctors. It's an opinion and it could be taken in a number of different ways.
Charles:It's, yeah, it's a lot of work. Yeah, it's hard to know what, know who to trust, and it's even harder to say I'm just going to do the work myself, because you're never really doing it yourself. You are standing on the backs of somebody else who's participated in that study or who's written it up or who's offered their opinion, and that's where, if you silo out where you get your news from, where you get your news analysis from, then you're more than likely going to be getting the information that you already agree with from sources that you already like, and so you're kind of just along for the ride, based on other people's opinions.
Dan:Yeah, you gotta really make an effort to be okay and be open to other information, even Not even being wrong just looking at or spending the time to look at other information.
Charles:Yeah, and I always look for when I'm trying to get information on anything that I care about. It's okay. Who can I listen to? That I 100% know beyond a shadow of a doubt is a smarter person than me, but I agree with less than 51% of the time, and even finding that kind of source is not I know, finding someone smarter than me it's not exactly Impossible.
Charles:I know it's not. You know it's needle in a haystack, so you gotta have a good magnet. But yeah, once I find people like that, that I think they're smarter than me and I rarely agree with them then it's like, okay, this is somebody who probably can have something to teach me. Yeah, okay. So that said, there are certainly advantages to limiting the kind of food you eat for a period of time, or if you eat any food at all.
Charles:Some of those would be losing weight. Some of those would be dropping water weight, specifically figuring out what foods you can tolerate, what foods you can't tolerate. I know that that's helpful. But yeah, the idea that you're gonna rid your body of toxins or free radicals as they used to call them in the 60s and 70s that was a big word that they like thrown around free radicals I would do it with a bit more of a concrete goal in mind before you jump into one of these cleanses that we're gonna talk about. So, juice cleanses I watched that documentary about the guy who did used his Breville juicer and only did fruit and vegetable juice for he did like three months or months.
Dan:I remember he was hardcore, he like brought it on the road. I remember he was like blending that stuff up in his trunk.
Charles:He was an Australian guy and he, like, traveled around the US only eating fruit and vegetable juice.
Dan:Yeah, and that inspired you right?
Charles:Yeah, my ex and I did 10 or 11 days of just fruit and vegetable juice. For me it was mostly fruit juice because I don't like vegetables, and so it was a lot of sugar. Obviously, I bet A lot of water. I think watermelon and, like Granny Smith, apples were my favorite things to put in juices.
Dan:Well, watermelon doesn't have a lot of sugar, so that's not so bad.
Charles:Boy, it tasted sweet though. Okay, I mean watermelon's real sweet. Yeah, I guess it could be, but Especially if you're only eating the pink part it's called water for a reason.
Dan:Yeah, there's a lot of liquid in there, absolutely yeah, watermelon's one of the better, I think, better options Interesting.
Charles:Yeah, yeah, so I did that, for I could have done straight up bananas and oranges. Yeah, exactly, or yeah, those are both real bad.
Dan:I'm not diabetic.
Charles:Yeah, berries are always good. It blows my mind how many berries you can eat for such a low number of calories and a low number of carbs, especially blackberries. They're so good. And when I'm really taking my diet seriously and I get hungry when I'm on the road, I pull in the Publix and I buy a small little six ounce thing of blackberries and it's like 70 calories and five grams of carbs or that might be wrong, but I think in that ballpark, yeah, yeah, it's not.
Dan:Even strawberries aren't that bad. I mean, I love berries, but they go bad so quickly.
Charles:It's unbelievable. Ah well, the secret is, when I get them at Publix, I throw away the empty carton in the garbage can outside of the because, like I eat them, like within seconds of the store, and so I don't. The empty carton doesn't even make it to my car, they're just gone.
Dan:Yeah, I leave my fridge for like two days and they're rotten already, so it's yeah, I do the frozen, so I don't like those as much. Yeah, they're not. They're not as good.
Charles:Yeah, I have used the frozen combo of strawberries, blueberries and bananas in oatmeal. Oh, nice All right, it tastes so good. Yeah, I just take a handful of the frozen stuff and microwave it in with the oatmeal. So when I'm lifting, that's my breakfast of choices is oatmeal with berries.
Dan:What, what inspired you to do the juice cleanse. What did you want to get out of it?
Charles:I want to see if I drop some weight. Mostly.
Dan:Was your aspiration, Charles. I'm not ready for an audit.
Charles:I wanted to see if I could. That guy dropped a bunch of weight when he did it. I want to see if I could drop some weight when I did it too.
Dan:He had like really bad immune system issues and I thought he had done some who he had been testing himself before and after and he had some pretty marked improvement. I think he did yeah.
Charles:Yeah, he, he did. He was doing mostly. I think he's doing mostly vegetable juice with some fruit juice, but I mean, I tried it all and I did not.
Dan:I could like anything with celery and did that extract the pulp, or was that part of the actual juice that it blended? All in together, good question.
Charles:I think that it had like a little screen that you dumped out with the pulp in it. I think some of it made it in there, but OK, so you got some of the fiber but not all of the fiber. Got it, yeah.
Dan:And they made that went. After that, I think people went crazy with the juicing.
Charles:Yeah. And I think they made all kinds of juicing and then Vitamix came out and that really I think came out after that or it got big after that movie.
Dan:Yeah, I think they're probably only about them. Yeah, they've probably got big. I got one not long after that, but not for juicing. They're making like nut butters and stuff. They're all high calorie, yeah, so yeah, did the lady lose some weight?
Charles:as well. Yeah, we both did. But when you get back on the processed food after a juice cleanser, after any kind of cleanser, any kind of fast, then you put the weight back on and that's that.
Dan:Do you guys just wing it, or did you look up a protocol for the juices, like how much to drink, what kind of food to use, whatever?
Charles:So you mostly went the easy way with the list of stuff you should put in, stuff you shouldn't put in, and then just kind of try to stick to that.
Dan:So you didn't have a plan to wean off of it either?
Charles:No, definitely not. I didn't even have a plan for how many days I was going to do it, I was just I'll try as long as I can and see how it goes. And then day 10 or 11 is when I tapped out. I think she went longer than I did, but it was. Yeah, it was not fun.
Dan:Did you have any cravings for chewing things? Because that's a big thing when you're only drinking liquid, you're not really chewing much. I had cravings for chewing a lot of things because I missed eating food.
Charles:So it's hard to say was it the chew-eater or was it the tasting good things? Because I did not like so many of the ingredients were just gross to me.
Dan:Yeah, you're very, you got good taste, but you can pick up a lot of stuff that I can.
Charles:Yeah, stuff has to be yummy if I'm going to be down. All right, Fast. And We've already talked about the benefits of fasting include a little bit of mental clarity. When you put yourself in that mode where you're not giving yourself food, your mind does sharpen up because it thinks it's time. Okay, we got to get serious now. We got to be at our best. We got to find some food To turn this around.
Dan:Yeah, we got to be yeah, elimination diet.
Charles:I've never done this but I know I mean, I guess carnivore is considered an elimination diet, so I guess maybe I have, I know, whole30 and stuff like that is out there. And yeah, I think the purpose is really to limit inflammation and I can understand that because we do spend a lot of our times as humans inflamed about over something. Yeah, and often it's what's going into our gut and the effect that it's having on our gut. Colon cleanse never done one of those.
Dan:I've not done a colon cleanse. However, I have done a. Not with like food and supplements. However, I have had a. What do they call those?
Charles:Colonic, you have, I have. They stick the garden hose up there, yeah you're in a bathtub.
Dan:You're in a bathtub and you see a clear garden hose and you're supposed to watch all of the fun stuff come out of you. I didn't have any fun stuff come out of me, though. No, no, nothing, wow, no, granted, I wasn't experiencing really any issues.
Charles:I was kind of like the feeling that hoses up your Easter.
Dan:So my girlfriend at the time was getting them regularly because she was a very restricted diet and I guess she was having some issues and she liked this one place and I'm like, listen, it's interesting, I have never had any type of cleanse before. Let's see what it's all about. And yeah, it was just very unproductive and a little gross or a lot gross.
Charles:Yeah, sounds like it could have been grosser if more stuff came out, it probably would have been yeah.
Dan:Yeah, it was a little bit of a gross thing.
Charles:What did it feel like? Was it uncomfortable?
Dan:No, I don't remember being uncomfortable. No, because it's not like they shove the tube that far up the butt. Okay, yeah. It wasn't. It wasn't uncomfortable and it was a real small, small little.
Charles:How old are we supposed to be when we get our colonoscopy? Is it 50 or is it? Have they lowered it?
Dan:I think they've. Well, I wonder if they lowered Prostate. I thought Prostate.
Charles:a lot of doctors aren't even using the finger on that anymore, they're just going by the blood.
Dan:Yes, yeah, yeah, they lowered one of them. We should really find out. Let's ask Siri, we'll ask Siri right now, yeah.
Charles:Hey Siri, at what age should I get my first colonoscopy? Doctors today recommend most healthy people get a colonoscopy starting at age 50.
Dan:All right, this is from Hopkins Medicine.
Charles:Oh, what is? What is John Hopkins University know about such things? Bah humbug. We'll call it 60. Yeah, just chill out for another decade. Yeah, all right. So colonoscopy at 50. You think you can do it.
Dan:I don't know, depends on how invasive it is, right. So I've heard that they've actually tore colon. It's pretty common to like tear your colon and, depending on what they're doing with the camera and stuff like that.
Charles:I've you know, does Dr Muzzy do that in office? Do you think? I don't think she does it in office. Okay, she said she would send you to somebody to get it done.
Dan:Probably yeah, I'd be. I'm going to be due soon. If I follow that advice, thing is, I don't have any digestive issues.
Charles:Well, that's the chronic. Should you only get it done at 50 if you're having issues, Dan or is it a diagnostic tool that everybody should.
Dan:Great question, I'll. I got an appointment with her in January, so I'll ask her about that.
Charles:I remember. Yeah, yeah, I don't. I don't have any issues that would lead me to get one done sooner, but I do. I do wonder is like okay, is that? Is it like, get it done sooner if you're having problems? But if you're, if you're clean as a whistle, no problems, then you start at 50. Yeah, yeah, because I know you, you got to drink some stuff and then you're like pooing all day to clean it out and I've heard it's pretty miserable. I heard the stuff. The worst part for me is always the stuff tastes bad, I hear, and so that would be for you yeah.
Charles:Yeah, I have to. It's like drink it tastes terrible, but drink it anyway. It's like I don't know about that.
Dan:I don't mind pooping everything, but just the drinking yeah.
Charles:See and not the out, Spend all day on the toilet. That's a normal Thursday but, but having to drink something that tastes bad? No thanks, yeah, so I'll be curious what she. I'll try to remind you before that appointment.
Dan:Yeah.
Charles:To ask her about 50 year colonoscopy sounds good. Although I got a few years left. Okay, a liver cleanse. I went straight to the last sentence in that paragraph. Keep in mind, though, that the science is still out on whether they truly work or not. Yeah, that's. I don't do things where the science is still out and feel like I'm doing something for my health.
Dan:Yeah, it's like it's almost a waste of a paragraph Like why?
Charles:do you even put it in here? Yeah, exactly, if you're going to tell me that the science is still out, it's like I'm not going to start doing something that I don't do already. Yeah, unless the science is in and it says you should start doing this, charles, it's really important. Yeah, so I'm not cleansing my liver, I'm not doing a bone broth cleanse, although I could see if I was, if I was just trying to drop some pounds, then maybe I would and I've done that.
Dan:I've done like a bone broth fast, where I've done coffee, bone broth tea was to lose weight.
Charles:Yeah, yeah, okay.
Dan:So yeah, yeah, we pretty Dan and I are kind of getting the ketosis too Cause it's okay, yeah, that makes sense, you can, yeah, yeah.
Charles:It was really quickly if you just stop eating. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, dan and I have the position mostly that these, these cleanses are made to cleanse water out of your body so you don't look so bloaty, and so the number of the scales not as high, and that's the primary benefit of most of these. Is that now, carnivore diet you know as as an elimination diet. I can see some other reasons to do that, but yeah, pretty much for me the reason I would do any of these is because I want to lose weight. Yeah, and if I'm not dedicated to losing weight, I'm not going to do any of them.
Dan:Yeah, I mean, you know I, that's true, it's not my first go to if I'm not feeling well regularly. I mean, thankfully that's not. I haven't run into a you know a long period of time where I'm, you know, constantly inflamed and have, you know, cold, or or you know symptoms from, from allergies or whatever. So I haven't felt like, oh, I need to do something, right, somewhat radical. You know some of these lenses it's multiple days, it's very restrictive, mentally exhausting If you don't balance.
Dan:So with any of these, I think it's important to maintain water and electrolyte balance, because that causes a lot of sickness. When you start any of these elimination diets, it's because, at a minimum, our body needs water and electrolytes to function properly. So, like hear about the keto flu feeling, feeling crappy about you know any of these detoxes and you know the other thing too is, if you are detoxing and you know stuff's coming out of you, that liquid, you need to replenish that Right, and if you don't, your brain doesn't function in the right way. So if you are going to do any of these, I would suggest doing them on a weekend or a day where you don't have a lot of stuff to do. If you're going to start them. Yeah, do it where you don't. You know, god forbid. You don't feel well, you can. You can still kind of function and you don't have a lot of responsibilities, right.
Charles:Yeah and yeah, you don't. You don't want to snap at your coworker because you're you're on a short fuse, because you're you're fasting. That's. That's another thing I would. I would try to avoid. All right, let's.
Charles:There's one short chapter on sleep that I want to talk about quickly. One of the points that he makes about sleep is that deep sleep is so important because that's when a lot of your your mental and physical regeneration happens. But it's the fourth stage, I believe, of sleep and you can only get to deep sleep after you get through the other ones. So if your sleep is constantly being interrupted and you know you're not getting to that level, then you're not going to get the full benefits of sleep. The other thing I want to say is I've listened to some sleep experts on other podcasts give interviews and basically we have this perception at least people who consider themselves to be high producers have this perception of I can get by with only four hours of sleep at night.
Charles:Blah, blah, blah. It's like what he said from his research is nobody functions at their best with less than six hours and most people need eight to be at their peak. So if you can get by with your four hours of sleep. Good for you, but you'd get by a lot better if you were getting eight or six. So, and again, I think it's a a sign of a broken society that we take pride in this. I only need four hours of sleep nonsense, yeah.
Dan:You know, the thing too is, if you're going to bed late, like you said, you're not going to get all four stages of sleep. You just it's not going to be enough time to get to that last stage the later you go to bed. So that's, you know, that's, that's, that's a pretty big deal, and one of the functions is it solidifies some learning.
Charles:So what I've learned is that the transition of short term memory to long term memory happens while you sleep?
Dan:Yeah, it moves to literally. They've tracked some of this information, not sure how, but from where it's stored in the front of your brain and it moves to the back of your brain. I think I've heard that too. It's so when, so, when you don't have to think about it, it's your subconscious kind of, or it's just an automatic type of knowledge that you have, like driving a car Right, it's, it's moved and that's when that happens in that, that deep sleep. What's interesting is, I've been looking, I've been experimenting with this keto alcohol and they also make exogenous ketones, and one of the things that I learned last night while I couldn't sleep, ironically was that some of these exogenous ketones including some MCT oil, which functions like an exogenous ketone can actually help with deep sleep. It doesn't help you fall asleep but, it does extend it.
Dan:And again, these are anecdotal, you know videos from the owner of the company, but apparently there's a Facebook group. People swear by it. I'm I definitely want to try it because I've I'm a notoriously light sleeper and I've got all kinds of devices and gadgets and things that I I use that does help me sleep. But I still struggle a little bit and I think most of that actually comes down to me eating too close to bed at night. Oh yeah, and for me, being a type one diabetic, what I notice is if my blood sugar is a little bit elevated, I don't sleep as deep and I don't wake up. Even if I'll sleep through the night, I don't sleep as deep and I wake up tired. So I think there really is something.
Dan:Even if you're not diabetic, your body is still processing that food and it's going to temporarily raise your blood sugar. So my thing is I really think that's probably one of the biggest factors why people don't sleep well is because we're eating all day long and we snack at night, and a lot of times that snacking is sugary stuff. So if you are going to eat at night, what I've learned in red is choose as much fat as possible, even minimize the protein, because your body will tend to convert the protein into carbohydrates while you're sleeping and it takes a lot longer to digest. It's going to raise your blood sugar a little bit. So if you are going to eat something, try and make it as fatty as possible and ideally as far away from bedtime as possible. So I'm struggling with that, doing that myself. It's not easy.
Charles:Yeah, let's talk about some of the other. I think when we talk about some of the sleep hygiene steps, you'll identify with all these, and I'm going to add to that too. Yeah, so dim your lights. I sleep best. When I was a kid I always wanted a nightlight on, but the older I got I want it pitch black. I want to be able to open my eyes and see nothing. That's when I sleep the best. And I've said before, the best sleep I ever get in my life is an inside cabin on a cruise ship.
Charles:Yeah, between the motion of the boat and the fact that you know when you put a towel along the bottom of the door it is pitch black and, oh, I sleep so good. It's part of the reason I want I'd love to do a. I've never done a solo cruise. I've only done a cruise with either my partner or with Rob, and having the room to myself where I just can turn everything off, everything dark, set the AC ice freaking cold, which is the next one we'll get into lower the temperature. Man, I sleep so good when it's cold and dark, like I'm in a cave. That is the best.
Dan:Yeah.
Charles:And it's making me want to go on a cruise. And we talked about before about the idea of some, like five of the Royal Caribbean ships, offer Patty Scuba certification you get on the, you get on the boat, know nothing, you get off the boat and you're certified. And I've thought about doing that as a solo, a solo cruise.
Dan:Do they say how many hours a day you have to spend in class?
Charles:I don't think it's a ton, I think it's like half the day. You, yeah, basically your shore excursion is your checkout dive, and then you spend time in the pool and you spend time in a class.
Dan:Okay.
Charles:And so yeah, I mean, if I miss a couple, you know, movie trivia that's fine. I was just yeah, I don't think it's grueling, eat your whole cruise, all no, I'm sure it's not, and they may even give you some of the material in advance Once you pay for it. They may send you some of the stuff to study on your own. But yeah, I love. I love a cold, dark room. So it does say to lower the temperature. Some studies say that it's cool as 60 degrees.
Dan:I like a cold, but not quite that cold. I think it's perfect, unless I get a thick blanket on top of me.
Charles:I like fifties or sixties, Like upper fifties, low sixties is ideal for me. I like it to be so cold that I don't want to get out from under the blanket. Yeah, I mean. Yeah, that is perfect.
Dan:When I go visit my family up in New.
Charles:Jersey and it also it's a way to get that a little bit with the window. It coerces my cat to be extra cuddly too.
Charles:Oh, nice so yeah, I like sleeping with the cat right by my head, and the colder it is, the more chance that he'll stick around. Oh, that's cute. So I'm very sensitive. I am a lover, it's great, I'm an amazing person, okay, so get rid of screens, obviously, no deal there.
Charles:I fall asleep with my phone. I have this, you know, like the microphone arms that we had before, yeah, and that we, you know, you have in your office and I've got, I've got one of those with a little phone holder on it and that is where I put on my ASMR videos. And usually I know I'm about to go to sleep when I have the. So if, yeah, like the phone would be right here on my right and elevated, yeah, I'm watching the ASMR video and then I roll over on my left so I'm facing away from it. That's when I know I'm about to really just go completely unconscious where I can still hear it, but I'm not watching it anymore. Interesting, okay, and yeah.
Charles:So screens out of the bedroom? Not going to happen. I'm not doing it. I don't have a problem that I'm trying to fix. I don't have a sleep quality issue that I'm trying to make better, and so, yeah, I wake up pretty much every morning, fairly ready to go, unless unless I've done something stupid like booking a five o'clock flight, you know, to some city that I want to go visit and then. And then I wake up cursing and angry at myself for doing it. But for the most part I wake up and I feel good and I'm ready to jump into the day. So I'm going to leave the leave the screen right next to my bed. Avoid stimulants. Everything has the stimulating effect that it can be felt even hours after your last cup of coffee. Yeah, what do we say? The half life of caffeine is 12 hours. Yeah, yeah, if your caffeine sensitive, as I am not, but if you are, then you probably need to stop drinking it way earlier in the day than you think you do. Yep, yeah.
Dan:So I mean to define that right. So a 12 hour half life means the amount that you take 12 hours later. Half of it is still in your system, right, system, Right? So 100 milligrams for a cup of coffee at 12 hours later, it's still 50 milligrams in your system.
Charles:Yeah, yeah, so it is. If, if, if you're sensitive to caffeine, then consider getting rid of it or just making it. You have some with your breakfast and then you're done. Yeah, where again you know I can, I can have some quite a few milligrams of caffeine floating around and it doesn't really impact me. Must be nice, it is I. I did notice what was a lot worse on my my sleep quality was alcohol, where if I had any alcohol, even not enough to get drunk or buzz, but just one drink, then the next day I would wake up feeling like, okay, I did not sleep nearly as well as I could have or should have.
Dan:Yeah, I mean, we've seen a couple of videos from a lot smarter people than we are about alcohol, where, yeah, they do exist.
Charles:When we say smarter than us, we're pretty much talking about Sam Harris or Andrew Huberman Pretty much.
Dan:Yeah, but it was like one drink of they. They've shown effects sleep and a lot of times people use it to to relax and they think it helps them sleep, and I know that's absolutely not the case for me too. Even one drink it might get me to sleep faster.
Charles:But the quality of the sleep I experience overnight is, I mean, yeah, because you drink enough alcohol, you pass out or you fall asleep. But the quality of the sleep, how you feel in the morning, because you know at some point your drunkenness is going to switch to your hangover, yeah, and you sleep on a hangover is not good and sleep drunk's not great. And so, yeah, again, it might help you get to sleep, but it's not going to help you get good sleep, Right. And so, yeah, one of the things I was looking at my, my countdown. I'm 720 days in and I'm going to do dry January again, so it'll be my third one, nice. But yeah, the hard mode is when you do dry January, you stay dry all between January. That's right. So this will be my third dry January in a row.
Dan:February through December. That's the challenge.
Charles:Yeah, exactly, but yeah, so I'm definitely noticing lower restaurant bills and better sleep. Those are the two benefits that I've gotten from letting go of the alcohol.
Dan:One thing I do want to look into and see if the issue with the decreased quality of sleep is with the acetyl aldehyde, the toxin that comes as a metabolite from alcohol, because there's a product out called Z-biotics that I've been taking.
Dan:That is basically a bacteria that eats up that acetyl aldehyde and you can take it 24 hours before you drink and I definitely do not get hung over. You get drunk, but you are not hung over the next day. However, I haven't paid attention if I'm sleeping any different, any better or any worse during the night, so I want to do it myself.
Charles:Yeah, I heard something because it may not be related and also referencing back to our episode a week or two ago on prebiotics. I heard a new term on a Andrew Huberman clip where he's interviewing somebody about prebiotics, probiotics and postbiotics. Yeah, the post, that's interesting. Yeah, so postbiotics basically you could just eat the things that are the same as what the bacteria in your gut produce. A postbiotic is what comes out of the bacteria after it's done. Oh, give me an example. You know an?
Dan:example Okay, I got no more information off. What is it that you got to?
Charles:put in your mouth here? Yeah, but it's. I think it comes in pill form, just like the three in the post. Okay, okay, but yeah, so huh. Yeah, the prebiotic is what it's like fiber, it's what they feed off of, right, and the postbiotic is what they produce. No, yes, what's the probiotic?
Dan:Probiotic is the bacteria themselves.
Charles:Okay, that's right, the pro is the bacteria, the pro is what they eat and the post is what they produce. And so, yeah, it's possible for humans to ingest all three of those and it has some kind of effect on you. That, I guess, is good. But okay, again, I. There's so many I almost shouldn't have brought it up. There's so little about it.
Dan:Yeah right, I mean that's that's. The tricky part is, there are so many different strains of bacteria and it's also temporary. There's no like colonization, so to speak. It's it's only in your system for a few hours and that's why you need to take it every day. It's there. It's not like they, they, they sit and they, they colonize and they make all this good stuff. So, but at the same time there are there are things where people are doing like poop transplants, fecal transplants, where they're curing, like irritable bowel syndrome and other diseases, by taking the poop, the fecal poop, and like blending it up and transplanting that into somebody who's sick and it's actually curing them and stuff. So yeah, and yeah, I'm not sure it's a donor because remember I got how much was that?
Charles:how much were you gonna make out of that Like it was? I want to say it was over a hundred thousand dollars a year. Oh, my god, that's right. Did you ever hear back from them, like donating every poop every day? They said the waiting list is like 18 months. Oh, so you're still in the running. Yeah, yeah, alright, yeah, I gave them my contact info and yeah, I think you could donate up to two times a day, every day, or something like that, depending on how much you go to the bathroom and based on your lifestyle, and once you know, once you get into the thing, they analyze your poo to see how it would be.
Dan:So it's like you better not quit the podcast once you become a rich pooper.
Charles:Man. That would be. That'd be a life man. You're not allowed Spitting strong to gold. Oh my god, that's nuts Like sir. We need you to eat more bed and jerry's in order to really get the high quality. Okay, well, for the people I'm helping, I'm willing to do it. Yeah, so they definitely do that.
Dan:Yeah, I forgot about that. Yeah, I forgot you they help people a lot.
Charles:And then, yeah, I think Kurt sent me a link about a video like on Instagram of somebody who was doing it and making money at it. I was like I'll look into this. I mean I'm gonna be on the toilet anyway, might as well make some money. Okay, so some other good sleep hygiene. Start your routine earlier, which, yeah, you've got your Alexa. I've got my watch telling me okay, time to wind down, time to get ready. Oh, and I ignored every day Don't eat too late, dan, some experts say not to eat dinner after eight.
Charles:It's like what you're eating after eight nobody could define as a dinner.
Dan:Oh my god, no, I, you know my solutions. I'm just gonna not eat ever again. I feel like that's too bad.
Charles:That abstinence is not a legitimate strategy when it comes to getting your your diet together, like it is with heroin. I'm just gonna abstain. Or alcohol. Get some good sheets. Let's see what it says.
Charles:Some studies shown that linen sheets actually help your keep your body several degrees cooler than other materials like cotton. Cotton is a good standard for most people. However, if you have sensitive skin, wash your sheets and unscented detergent to prevent irritation. Yeah, I god, when I have to stay somewhere that uses a flowery scent on their sheets, it drives me wild. I, like you know, hotels don't really put any kind of scent on their sheets and I use tide-free pods when I wash my clothes and my in my sheets. Right now I am using now I've got weird, weird size sheets, because I live on an RV queen mattress, which is like a regular queen mattress, except it's five inches shorter, and so it's just as wide as a queen bed, but five inches shorter than a queen, and it only really matters when it comes to the fitted sheet. You gotta buy a fitted sheet that is for a short queen or RV queen, and so there's not a ton of options on Amazon that are not microfiber, and I do not want microfiber sheets.
Charles:They are the worst, and so, yeah, I found one. One company that sells and makes high thread count cotton sheets. Okay and so that's what I use and they work well for me. I like them, but I doubt there's anybody out there making linen sheets for for RV size mattresses.
Dan:I mean, couldn't you just take a flat sheet and tuck it in and get maybe some sort of clips for the bottom of it or something like that?
Charles:That would require me giving more of a shit than I do.
Dan:Well, I mean, I get for me, I am. So you know I'm such a light sleeper. I would go to all these extents to better sleep. Oh yeah, I would for sure.
Charles:Maybe, maybe, okay. So I guess I could get a regular queen size flat sheet and just fold it up, do my little hospital corners and turn it into a fitted sheet.
Dan:I wonder, even if I wonder if a fitted sheet would even be better, because you'd at least have the one side kind of fitted right, because the width is working. It's just it's a little bit long.
Charles:Oh, that's true. I guess I could just tuck the extra under.
Dan:That way, you're only worried about one side.
Charles:That's true. Yeah, it's really only the foot of the bed where it would be too long and I could just. I could just pull it tight and tuck it under.
Dan:Yeah, probably.
Charles:Interesting. Why haven't I tried that before?
Dan:I don't know, I'm gonna try that in mine, I think.
Charles:You could go with a linen sheet, you think?
Dan:Yeah, I think so. I have these special sheets that I got from a sleep number that are like cooling they're particularly expensive, but they work. I'm cold when I sleep on those things.
Charles:Really yeah, but you also have a cooling system.
Dan:I have the ruler from Chili's sleep. Yes, I do so. How do you know which is which? I've taken the sheets to hotels to my family's place like that and it's a lot different than the cotton stuff that they. They've got there for sure. Okay, it makes the biggest difference on the pillow, the pillowcase, for me.
Charles:So yeah, the other thing I'll say that he I don't think he mentions, he does say use a noise machine, which you can. You know, if your phone is by your bed and plugged in charging all night, you can just set a long YouTube video at least, at least if you have YouTube premium. I would not want to watch a long video then, for you know, with green noise or pink noise or brown noise or whatever the different noises are, and then have an ad come on in the middle of it.
Dan:I have an air purifier. That Okay, it makes noise.
Charles:Yeah, and it's I. Actually I just recently got a second dehumidifier for my RV, okay, and that does make a nice light little noise as kind of some some background noise. But yeah, you can also just put music or, yeah, spotify, I'm sure they have green noise and white noise and all kinds of different noises that you can use to to keep next to you and and help you chill more. The other thing I will say is mattresses. Mattresses and running shoes I think people tend to wear, to use them longer than they should. They will wear out in ways that you can't see or feel, but they're worn out. So, consider mattresses generally. I don't believe last as long as the mattress company tells you that they last.
Charles:Yeah, and so I'm ready to to upgrade my mattress. I'm gonna go to. Right now I got a hybrid where it's got springs and foam. I'm gonna go straight to a straight foam and I've noticed that when you get foam that is infused with gel and has like a bamboo cover on the mattress, some of the problems that you ran into a few years ago with latex getting too hot, I don't really have. I have not noticed that problem on the RV mattresses that I've used that are foam based. Yeah, like again memory foam with some sort of gel infused material. I've not got noticed that I get. I get really hot, so I'm gonna maybe I should go ahead and order one of those today, yeah.
Charles:I'll wait till I'm. We're gonna move in a week. I'll wait till the move and then figure out what I can do to throw away the, the mattress usually. Usually that can be a bit of a challenge to roll it up or fold it up and get it in a dumpster somewhere when somebody's not looking Alright. So I think that covers it. The other question was about water. Do you take water next year? You have water next year.
Dan:I do, I do, but I also do have to pee. I drink way too much water before bed, before even getting to bed, but I bring that you just pee the bed and I just pee the bed. I just cut out the middleman. I know I do keep a bottle of water next to my bed, but I also do mouth taping at night.
Charles:Oh, I've heard about that.
Dan:I've not ever tried that I use medical grade tape to keep my mouth closed and I always sleep better with my mouth taped Really Always. And you use a CPAP, too right, and I use a CPAP and I have earplugs and eye mask. You use the earplugs and eye mask at home, or?
Charles:travel. Oh yeah, oh, I use it for everything. Oh yes, yeah, I never. I use it when I travel. I don't use it when I'm.
Dan:I don't use the eyes or the or the earplugs I probably don't need to. I've just gotten that habit and just how I'm sleeping.
Charles:Yeah you know, yeah, I heard Tom Segura was advertising on his podcast for mouth tape called. It's called like hostage tape.
Dan:Yes, I've seen that it's historical.
Charles:Yeah, and I've not tried it.
Dan:It's a lot more expensive than normal medical grade tape that you can use from 3M. Now what about your, your facial hair? Does it not stick to it? No, because I mean I just it's just over the lips. It's just it's like an inch wide and I just put it over lips and it keeps my mouth closed. I'm not like giving myself a hostage situation by any means.
Charles:Yeah, I have recently learned about tape that only sticks to itself. Yeah so you could, like, literally wrap it around your entire head, and it doesn't stick to hair, it doesn't stick to skin, it only, it only, yeah, like has friction on itself, and so, yeah, I could use that and then not worry about I mean, but they make tape that just comes off easily.
Dan:It's medical tape for, you know, for wounds and things like that, or if the whole bandages to your skin and it's just from 3M and it's like, it's like $5 a roll or whatever.
Charles:Okay, that's not too bad, and so you tape your mouth closed and that helps because you better quality sleep.
Dan:Yeah, because, because we're supposed to be breathing through our nose all the time, we're not supposed to breathe through our mouth. Biology, really? Yeah, because there's. There's a lot more of. I don't have all the details behind it, but even running and things we're supposed to be breathing through our nose just because I think there's a certain gas exchange that happens with some of the parts of our nose on the inside. Something to do with it adds nitrogen, I think, the proper amount of nitrogen to the oxygen that you're breathing in, to the air that you're breathing in, and it's better for our lungs. But yeah, our nose is meant for breathing, not really our mouth.
Charles:I think I've got some level of a deviated septum from when I broke my nose in high school, and so I think I'm probably a bit of a mouth breather.
Dan:I'm a mouth breather.
Charles:Yeah, I think so. Yeah, or because I'm dumb, I think that's a. Yeah, yeah, why is mouth breather associated with lower intellect? That's a great question. I don't know. I'll have to read a book and move my finger across the word, as I researched that at some point that was definitely a boy, that was, that was a. That was a that made you a target when I was in school. If you were, if you were moving your finger along with the words yep, it was like what's wrong with that guy? Right?
Charles:Fortunately I was not one of those people. I wasn't either, but I should have. I was probably one of the ones that made fun of them, so hopefully I'm a better person now. I don't know.
Dan:Hopefully they're. They're better people now. The other one hopefully you inspired them to be through my shame, through your shaming.
Charles:Well, bernay Brown has taught us that doesn't work.
Dan:Oh, the other thing that was another person who's smarter than we are.
Charles:Yeah, exactly.
Dan:Yes, we got three now.
Charles:Three now Harris short list Bernay Brown. The other thing that was a bit of a a shaming experience was if you were reading to yourself and still moving your lips.
Dan:Oh right, yeah, Interesting thing I learned recently is that a lot of people who get laryngitis are avid readers and what happens is, even though we are not making a noise or moving our mouth, our vocal cords are moving as we read Really, and that wears them down. So avid readers and I've known people who don't talk a lot but they get laryngitis and throat issues all the time and they're avid readers Interesting.
Charles:I had no idea.
Dan:Yeah, I don't remember where I learned it.
Charles:But I'm not making it up, no.
Dan:I'm not making it up and I don't think it was from you know, it might have been Huberman. Okay, all right, might have been a Huberman. He's on the list, so we won't trust what he has to say. Yeah, I thought it was fascinating, that is. That's wild.
Charles:I had no idea.
Dan:Throats all the time and stuff like that. Yes, cause the vocal cords keep moving.
Charles:One of the interesting facts that I heard that is adjacent to that, was the idea that as you get older, if you refuse to get hearing aids, dementia, it brings on dementia. Yeah, if you're inability to hear and turn sounds into concepts, essentially yeah. If you lose that ability, then you lose the ability to reason and the ability to think.
Dan:Yeah, it's crazy, which is wild it really is.
Charles:Oh, I just don't hear. So well, I don't want to get a hearing aid.
Dan:I mean full disclosure. My dad never wanted to get a hearing. He doesn't have a hearing aid and he needs one. And you know, he says it makes him look old, and I mean I love him, I love you, dad. He's 85, though, and it's like Everything else makes him look old too. Right, yeah, and what makes you look older is when you can't hear anything at a dinner table and you're like not part of the conversation.
Charles:Yeah, because you can't hear anything and you lose your ability to think, and somebody has to say something to you four times louder and louder and louder.
Dan:What do you think makes you look older? That or hearing aid that can barely make out in your ear anymore.
Charles:Right, ok, that's what we should. I think hearing places to sell hearing aids and the hearing aids like don't require a prescription anymore.
Dan:I don't think so. It changes the law. I'm never hearing about that. Yeah, oh really, did I just say that?
Charles:Sorry, that's OK. We should go to one of the hearing aid places that gives free hearing tests to get our hearing checked. All right, let's do it. Let's see. See where we're at.
Dan:Yeah, I haven't had that done since I was probably in grade school. Same yeah, it's been a long time. Beep, beep, beep Exactly.
Charles:Yeah, raise your hand when you hear it Right, yeah, yeah, I remember there was a bit on Cosby where he got it done and he was like jamming along, of course, what a great guy. Boy Missed that show. Yeah, so we should go get hearing tests done and see how we're doing. I did get an eye exam recently, within the last year or so.
Dan:And do you still have both eyes? I still have both eyes, congratulations.
Charles:So you passed, all right, nice 2015. And each eye individually in 2010 combined, wow.
Dan:That's insane. Dude. Eyes of the hawk that's amazing. Yeah, once I hit 40, that's when, yeah, I needed glasses for the first time. Yeah, and people out there, don't jump to get a prescription right away. Try readers first. I've spent so much money on a prescription, oh, really.
Charles:Don't need it Interesting.
Dan:Don't need it. I could have gotten readers from Walgreens for $30.
Charles:OK.
Dan:Instead of $700, some odd dollars from an eye doctor.
Charles:I guess the key is look at the prescription that they give you and if it is 1.25 on both eyes, then yeah, just go get a, even if it's not just go to the.
Dan:I mean go, try it out Go try it out and see if you can see stuff. I mean, is it really that's all they're doing at the doctor's office?
Charles:anyway, yeah, I imagine the quality of the lenses is probably higher.
Dan:Probably and you probably get, yeah, and you can get real refined, cool looking frames. Well, I mean, you know Warby Parker is pretty good, but like I guess, different lens, Like you know, if one eye is a little off than the other one, yeah. Ok, I mean, if you've got some significant you know vision, obviously go with the doctor, but if things are a little blurry and you need, you know, got to use your phone to light up the bill before signing the check at night like I have to do on time, so bearish.
Charles:Go get some readers. Next time we go to dinner I'm going to bring my headlamp and turn it on so you can see the check, Since I'm going to pass you.
Dan:Actually, could you make a scene and tell the restaurant to lighten up the place, like, turn the lights up, ryder.
Charles:So I'm going to be passing the check your way. Anyway, I might as well provide a torch for you.
Dan:Well, it's not your birthday anymore, so All right, Dan.
Charles:So yeah, I guess this episode is going to probably come out after Christmas, but before New Year's All right. Well, any resolutions you want to share.
Dan:Yeah, going to be actually working on my coaching business. We're going to be working on the coaching business for the podcast.
Charles:That's true. That's true. We come New Year and we might have a call to action for yeah. Ask our deadbeat listeners to finally pitch it and do something.
Dan:Right, right, and maybe give a little value in exchange. We'll see, we'll see yeah.
Charles:The extent of the ask will probably be go to this website and take this, take this test and tell us what you think about it. That will probably be about as far as we're going to go off the bat task. You do anything, but then I put a lot of time in the mindfully masculine mojo meter test that we were working on last night. I love the mojo meter.
Charles:Yeah, and we put a lot of effort coming up with good questions on that and developing a good tool for you to use to assess the different areas of your life and how satisfied you are, and so we'll probably, come New Year's, we'll be sharing that and asking our listeners to go check it out and tell us what they think. I'm excited for that. Yeah, me too. I think I was a little surprised with the area of my life that I had the most dissatisfaction you pretty much called yours exactly right off the bat yeah.
Charles:You knew what it was going to be and you were dead on. Yeah Mine, I was a little surprised. So, yeah, we'll share some new stuff. We're going to be talking with our podcasting coach, adam here in the not too distant future and working with him in some new ways, and we'll be going to pod fest in January in Orlando, 25th I think, 29th yeah.
Charles:And we'll share the episodes. I'll tell it right now. We made an appointment to be on Adam's show where he does a podcast audit, where he asks us you know, what our pain points and our intentions are with the podcast and where we want to go and what's getting, what's standing in our way. So we're going to have to answer some tough questions for Adam and then we'll share that on all of our social media feeds and maybe even share. We'll see if we're able to share an episode of his podcast on our feed so that you guys can get to it super easy. Yeah, and yeah, I'm looking forward to seeing him at pod fest and talking to him to get his insight on what we're doing and what we could be doing better.
Dan:Yeah, I'm excited to start working on smoothing out some of those pain points before we actually get on the call with him. So ideally.
Charles:Yes, we will do. We're actually work on that right now. Do some homework as soon as we hang up with you guys. All right, dan, thanks very much. I will chat with you later and I think we are going to be getting into what's the next section on wellness. Is this the one where we have to talk about touching ourselves?
Charles:We can talk about touching each other. That'd be a quick conversation. Yeah, the next episode will be with the alternative here. The next episode will be CBD and masturbation. Oh, that sounds like a real party. All right, man, I'll talk to you later. Bye.
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