How Well Do You Respect Boundaries? Key Questions to Ask Yourself

In this episode, Dan and Charles explore the complex issue of respecting boundaries in relationships. Using insights from Faith Harper’s *Un-F your Boundaries*, they dive into self-reflection by asking key questions about how well we respect the boundaries of others, especially in close, emotionally-charged relationships. 

The conversation covers:

• The challenges of maintaining non-judgmental communication with loved ones vs. acquaintances
• Why we tend to violate boundaries in close relationships and the emotional risks involved
• The concept of loss aversion and how it shapes the way we approach relationships and conflict
• How romantic partners can struggle with being treated like therapists, and why this is damaging
• The importance of recognizing personal limitations in respecting boundaries
• Navigating unsolicited advice and finding healthy ways to avoid overstepping boundaries
• The psychological strategies for better communication and empathy, including the STFU method: Share, Time, Find Empathy, and Understand

Dan and Charles also share personal stories about how they’ve learned (or failed) to respect boundaries in their relationships, and the growth that comes from understanding others' limits. They highlight the role of emotional honesty and accountability in building stronger, more respectful connections with those around us.

Key Questions to Reflect On:

1. Do people respond positively to you when sharing their thoughts and feelings?
2. Are you able to maintain deep and authentic exchanges with those close to you?
3. How well do you respect others' boundaries when their choices cause you concern?
4. Do you find yourself giving unsolicited advice? How can you handle that differently?
5. What strategies can you use to better understand and honor the boundaries of others?

Join us for a thought-provoking discussion on respecting boundaries and how it can lead to healthier, more fulfilling relationships.

**Listen Now** to discover how mindful communication and respect for boundaries can transform your interactions with others!

Chapters

• 0:00 Introduction
• 1:25 Respecting Boundaries in Relationships
• 4:12 Loss Aversion and Sunk-cost Fallacy
• 5:01 Deep and Authentic Exchanges
• 9:53 Unsolicited Advice and Boundaries
• 16:03 Handling "No" and Rejection
• 16:45 Resilience and Mindfulness in Relationships
• 39:57 Accountability for Boundary Violations

Transcript

Charles: 0:00

Welcome back to the Mindfully Masculine Podcast. This is Charles. I am recording this on Sunday, October 6th, for release tomorrow, Monday October 7th, and we are again on the verge of another major hurricane hitting Florida, so hopefully next week's episode will be out on time, but no promises. So Dan and I will continue to discuss Un-F your Boundaries by Dr Faith Harper. Topics covered in this week's episode include respecting boundaries in relationships, fear of conflict in close relationships, loss aversion and the sunk cost fallacy, deep and authentic exchanges, unsolicited advice and boundaries, therapist versus romantic partner roles, handling no and rejection, teaching resilience, mindfulness and self-awareness, communication strategies, respecting people versus respecting ideas, and handling boundaries and accountability. Thank you so much for listening. Please check out our website mindfullymasculinecom for any info we feel is worth sharing and enjoy the show.

Dan: 1:10

Good morning Charles. How are you?

Charles: 1:12

I'm well, dan, thank you. How are you? I am also well, excellent. So we're really rounding it out with the end of this book here. We've got a couple episodes left this one and probably one more and then we'll be done with Un-F your Boundaries by Faith Harper, which I'm looking forward to.

Charles: 1:25

Moving on to the next book. This chapter is called how Do you Respect Other People's Boundaries, and I like that. It starts off with a few questions that can serve as a diagnostic for how good are you at respecting other people's boundaries and what are some clues that this might not be your forte? And yeah, we can take some time to answer these for ourselves and maybe that'll help people answer them for themselves as well. First question she asks is generally speaking, do people tend to respond positively to you? Do they tell you they feel comfortable sharing with you and that you hear them without judgment? I would say, generally speaking, yes.

Charles: 2:11

The problems I've run into in the past is with my partners. I'm not quite as good at that V skills as I am with my immediate circle. Why do you think that is Because there's it feels like there's more to risk to to being able to hear people without judgment. I don't generally get defensive with relationships or in relationships that don't really matter a lot to me. It's a lot easier, sure, yeah, like if I'm in a relationship with somebody and I feel like conflict would lead to a situation where I feel a sense of loss, then I'm actually more likely to exacerbate that conflict exacerbate that conflict.

Dan: 3:09

It makes sense because our once we quote-unquote have something as human beings, it's much more valuable, right?

Charles: 3:12

so we're much more loss avoidant than I was just having a conversation with my girlfriend last night about how you feel worse about losing 20 dollars than you feel good about finding 20 dollars. Yeah, and I think that's generally the way that we react to things. We're, like you said, more loss averse than we are.

Dan: 3:31

Averse that's the word I was waiting for, not avoidant, but yeah.

Charles: 3:34

Yeah, that's definitely true, and so, as a result, those close relationships feel valuable in a way that you feel like you're. You have to defend them, you have to hoard them yeah, the way that you don't feel about other relationships.

Dan: 3:50

so it's easy to be not judgmental when you don't feel like so much is at risk I'm wondering if there's also like a time element that adds value to the relationships that we're talking about, so the ones we're spending the most time with end up becoming some of the most valuable. So I through stronger loss aversion those types of relationships, right?

Charles: 4:12

yeah, yeah, loss aversion. And also you can fall into that sucking cost fallacy too. Yeah, exactly where it's like I've spent so much time and effort in this situation, so therefore I need to throw more time and effort at it when sometimes that drive outlasts the actual value or the return on that relationship.

Dan: 4:35

It's tough. I feel like you need to figure out some sort of objective way of measuring what you've put in it Right what you've put in it Right.

Charles: 5:01

So same thing, like with a used car and you're going through this with your car too is like at what point? You got a great deal, it was only $4,000, but it's going to cost $1,000 to fix the air conditioner. And then you just say, well, if the sticker on this guy was 5,000 instead of 4,000, would I still bought it? Yeah, I would have. Okay, then no problem, go ahead and put you know $1,000 into it, but it and dry as much as you and I, as engineers, we would love to. Yes that it was that cut and dry with relationships, it just isn't squeeze a square peg into the round hole. Well, I think it's worked somehow, right, yeah? So the next question is do you have people, or at least one person in your life with whom you're able to have deep and authentic exchanges of ideas and feelings? And, yeah, I would say that I'm lucky. I have multiple people like that in my life where I can really, and Radha is the only one that I have to pay, so that's nice.

Charles: 5:48

Oh, you pay just in different ways, I guess that's true, yes, but Radha is the only one that I have to write a check through to have those deep and authentic exchanges with, where I've got other friends, among whom I number you that we can have those deep conversations. And then the third question are you able to maintain these relationships over a long period of time? Well, in your case, yes, and everybody else's case, not really. Again, renata, but I pay her to listen to me. So how about you? I assume you have people in your life that you can have deep and authentic exchanges with. Yeah, not a whole lot.

Dan: 6:23

Obviously, you are definitely one of them, probably on one of the deepest levels, is for sure, with you, and then it's been a challenge for me to figure out at what level am I out of my depth, I guess is the best way to put it with certain relationships, right? So I know I've relied too much on my romantic partner. Yeah, I was gonna test and I definitely think, looking back, that shot me in the foot.

Charles: 6:50

Yeah, yeah, we've. We've mentioned that on this podcast before about, uh, the threat that relationships face when speaking of trying to put those square pegs around holes. You try to turn your partner into a therapist, and not every thought you have is made to be vented to your romantic partner, nobody else in your life that you can share those thoughts with. Then it does feel like, well, she's my only choice for airing this, these insecurities or these things that I get angry about, like she's the only one that I have to talk to, period.

Dan: 7:35

So therefore, if I'm gonna not just keep these things completely bottled up, I've got to unload them on her yeah, but you're asking a tall order unless she works professionally in that area, like you're asking somebody who may not have experience in handling and being able to advise and being a therapist, right, and it's unfair then, because if your expectations are, hey, you should be willing to do this, you should be good at doing this, at making me feel better, and then now, yeah, you're introducing a whole bunch of problems into the relationship because your expectations are not based in reality at that point and there's so many. The good thing is these days there's so many different forms of people who can do. You've got coaches, you've got therapists, you've got psychiatrists, absolutely At many levels, so wherever you're comfortable with. But the difference is you got to be willing to part with your money and realize that there's value there there's value there, a lot of.

Dan: 8:35

Especially if you're not used to paying for conversation, correct, it could feel like, oh my god, I'm paying how much for what seems like be floating in the air, right? No, like tangible value that a book or something like. So I think that is why got to be careful of you don't want to give your partner reasons to move you from the category of boyfriend or husband into the category of patient.

Charles: 9:16

Because if she's a good therapist, she's generally not wanting to sleep with her patients. Good point If you work yourself into that patient category because you're constantly unloading all of your Good point on about wanting to be with you yeah, you gotta remember that you are responsible for providing things for the relationship as well.

Dan: 9:47

Right, and not just a need. Take kind of basis, yeah a hundred percent.

Charles: 9:53

what kinds of situations make it hard for you to respect the boundaries of others? Is it with certain people or when people are making certain decisions that cause you concern? Yeah, I would say like respecting some. Everybody, whether they verbalize it or not, for the most part has a boundary or preference. They don't want to get unsolicited advice from you. That's generally. We don't want that as humans, but it's difficult for me If I'm in a situation where I see somebody that I care about having difficulty. That I think I've got the answer to oh yeah.

Charles: 10:30

It's very hard for me to go to them and say, hey, do you want to hear any advice about this, before just unloading it all. Unloading the advice on them yeah, loading it all. Loading the advice on them yeah. So that's a situation where it does definitely make it difficult for me to respect that boundary that I perceive that they have, whether they've expressed it to me or not. We all imprint our own boundaries on other people, and I certainly don't want somebody just coming up to me saying, hey, you should handle that this way instead, and so, as a result, I think it's healthy for me to assume that other people don't want that either so you know what my unhealthy workaround is for that with that oh, I will give the advice and then I'll make a little joke about it and I'll be like, oh, yeah, here's the, I'll make a little joke to excuse it.

Dan: 11:17

To sit, to apologize and go yeah, this is the unsolicited advice. I apologize for the unsolicited advice I just gave you, kind of thing. So I still get that fix of yeah, you feel like you're, I feel like I'm helping, scooping into the rescue, right, and then at the same time, but you're giving them an out, they piss off Right, exactly, but it's already, it's. I'm not asking in advance. So I've still violated the boundary in that respect. Right, I didn't. And you also know that when you give them, I'm struggling with it.

Charles: 11:47

When you give them the choice to ignore your advice after you've already offered the advice, you know that there's very little chance that they're going to say hey, I'm glad you said that, because I was planning on ignoring this advice anyway, and don't give me any more in the future, unless I ask for it. Nobody does that.

Dan: 12:03

No, they're always like oh no, thanks, that's helpful. Blah, blah, blah, blah. Wouldn't it be nice? Yes, right, exactly. And so, yeah, I've done that enough to where I need to stop, because I'm not feeling good about it.

Charles: 12:15

That's a good indication that you might be ready for a change. She says after you ask yourself these questions of do people respond positively to you? Do they share things with you? Do you have people that you can have these deep conversations with? Are you maintaining your relationship?

Charles: 12:31

If the answer to any of these is no, that doesn't give you an excuse to shame and beat yourself up. That just gives you an opportunity to say okay, these things are not going as well as I'd like them to. So maybe I do need to revisit how I handle other people's boundaries and how I use other people's boundaries as a way to show them that I respect them and that I'm okay with them being their own person, instead of feeling like, okay, I've got to. I've got to adjust you so that you turn into what I need you to be and yeah, so don't beat yourself up too much If it's. If you notice that you tend to do that, just realize that you've got an opportunity to make a change here. That's going to be better for you and for them and for your relationship. And it's real. It can be difficult to not. When a book like this points out something that you're doing wrong, it's really easy to make that leap from I'm doing this thing wrong to there's something wrong with me.

Dan: 13:30

Yeah, yeah, you got to, absolutely, you've got to put the brakes on a little bit. Yeah, I think, as humans we do, we tend to go extreme, like from one end to the other it's just like oh, I wasn't even aware of this. Oh, my god, I'm a piece of junk because I'm doing this. Yes, and it's hard to kind of. What helps bring me back is just remembering hey look, nobody's perfect, I'm human, I'm working on, I'm figuring it out. At least I'm aware of it, I can do something about it now.

Charles: 14:00

It's better than where I was literally five minutes ago, when I wasn't even aware of it yeah, and it also gives you the opportunity to remember that one question you can always ask of people that you have really any relationship with is okay, what do you need from me right now, or what do you expect of me right now, and then you can let them say well, I know you've been through a similar situation, so I was hoping you would tell me exactly what you did to solve it, so that I could do that, too.

Dan: 14:29

My dream scenario I know, I don't think that would ever, I don't think I was ever gonna.

Charles: 14:34

I told him I keep waiting for him, but it almost never. Oh, that sounded good just listening to that.

Dan: 14:41

Yeah, that would be, and I think that's something that, as men, you're so wise and experienced, I really was looking to do everything exactly what you were going to tell me to do, and give you positive feedback about it, like yeah I think, oh, I wish, as men, that is something that we are.

Charles: 14:57

We're always waiting to hear and we rarely hear it.

Charles: 15:02

And rarely should we hear it, because everybody's situation is different and nobody owes us that level of worship at our altar yeah it would be to hear that, but it's something that I think we have this expectation that if we're not hearing that, that means that people don't love us or respect us or look up to us. But it's really just, it's a fantasy. Yeah, there's no. People don't talk that way. We shouldn't expect it. I've never said that to somebody. Oh, yeah, no, so why should I expect anybody?

Dan: 15:36

to say it to me. Yeah, the closest I've come to is hey, can I get your advice?

Charles: 15:39

The same, yeah, same, yeah, yeah, hey, can I pick your brain? Yeah, right, you know that's that's about. Yeah, the best we can hope for. And if somebody did lay that kind of praise on top of me and trying to butter me up, I'd be like what's going on right now, what's your angle like? I think that I want that, but if it really happened to me, I'd be like what's going on right now, right, right, because that's not natural. Yeah, absolutely, uh, okay.

Charles: 16:03

So she then gets into uh, no-transcript we want to do, or we're requesting to do, so what's the way that we could handle those no messages that we get from people in the best way? First, we pay attention to our own feelings with some self-compassion and we allow ourselves to be honest about man. I was really hoping that I would get a yes in this situation and I didn't, and it sucks and I feel really crappy about that. We can do that. One of the things when I talk about our podcast to other people who ask me well, what's it about? What do you guys talk about?

Charles: 16:45

One of the weaknesses that I think is out there right now that young men struggle with men in general, but especially young men, is I don't think we're being taught resilience at any kind of level where it can make a meaningful difference in our lives when it comes to, certainly, dating relationships and a guy gets either a no to a girl that he's asked out or he gets, or he gets broken up with.

Charles: 17:17

Like very few times do I see a guy who is willing and able to say man, I really wanted this to happen, it meant a lot to me and the fact that it's not going the way that I wanted to really sucks, it really hurts. It's either we either pretend like it doesn't hurt us at all and we just blow it off like screw her, I didn't want to go out with her that much anyway. Yeah, we either minimize our feelings or we minimize the pain of not getting what we wanted. In my case, I didn't have a dad that was telling me pretty much all of what life is going to be about is trying really hard to get things that matter a lot to you and dealing with not getting the most of the time and realizing, okay, I put in a lot of work for this job, for this girl or this mortgage I wanted to get approved for whatever it is. I put in a lot of work and I didn't get the thing that I wanted, and that's okay.

Dan: 18:22

I'm gonna live to fight another day, and there will be other things that I want that I do end up getting.

Charles: 18:24

Yeah, it's just that that mindset, yeah, that mindset is not something I was taught and I don't know that most of my friends got that, got trained in that either.

Dan: 18:31

I think in anybody that I know that is quote unquote trained in that or is good at that. It wasn't explicitly taught to them that way. It was, they witnessed it. They had good role models who behaved in those ways when they had those adversities, and so those were lucky people I feel like were fortunate to basically learn through osmosis, almost right yeah, and I think, when it comes to learning things and teaching things to other people, you've got.

Charles: 19:03

There's really three ways. Either somebody tells you what you should do, or somebody shows you what you should do, and out of those two, showing is definitely better than telling. But the third option, which is way better, is somebody who tells you what to do and then shows you how to do it. That's really how you learn life skills, especially these soft skills that you're not going to get from a book. It's going to be. Hey, here's how you should handle this. Now watch me as I handle it exactly this way, and let's talk about what my results are.

Dan: 19:33

Yeah, I think that's probably why we love that. Why has nobody told me this before book? Correct, that is really what you just described. Yeah, she tells you about it, she gives you situations, she says how she handles it and also how she guides patients through those specific things and those specific situations. So I think that's probably also a testament to why that book is so popular.

Charles: 19:55

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Dan: 19:56

Not just with us.

Charles: 19:57

Yes, I, that's. I always cite. That book is the one that we've covered on this podcast that I haven't had a bunch of complaints about, or really any. She got it pretty much dead on yeah, put no in his proper place. So one of. I'm trying to remember which book it was. I think it might have been Dating Essentials for Men, where Glover really helped frame rejection as this is. Yeah, it was that book where he was basically saying when you ask a girl out and she says no, she is not offering an objective evaluation of your value and worth as an individual. She's saying I have low interest in going out with you right now. That's really as far. That's all she is capable of saying to you. She doesn't know you. She doesn't know everything you're about what you really like when nobody's around. She doesn't know you. She doesn't know everything you're about what you really like when nobody's around. She doesn't know any of those things.

Dan: 21:03

All she knows is based on what you presented to me so far, I have a low level of interest in going on a date with you of the situation of yourself.

Dan: 21:13

You will realize that she has very little information to go on, right, you are presenting, and that also might help you in another way where you might make a little bit more of an effort to present more information and be willing to present more information to her, to literally everybody's in sales all the time.

Dan: 21:34

You do need to sell people on things it's not a bad word, right, and yeah, and sales is really just presenting information of that that you feel would be beneficial for that other person, right, yeah, and so if you feel like you can bring benefits to her life by being in it and being a part of that relationship, then you absolutely should be talking about it and selling it and presenting it, and most of us that takes work and effort to do that, right. So I think somebody telling you that you should focus on it, exactly right. So if you're not mindful, right, and so you can. The nice thing is, by meditation you could actually end up getting better relationships because you're practicing building that mindfulness muscle of your own self-awareness, and then you can now apply that to this kind of situation here. Or a job right. If you're going for a job interview too, it's just like how much information are you giving that other person about you? The more information they have, the better decision that they will be able to make.

Charles: 22:32

Yeah, because how different is the emotional experience of getting to know on either asking to grow out for a date, or getting to know on trying to get hired for a position or trying to get a new client. If you own your own business, it's. You can either look at it in terms of why am I such a loser, why am I such a piece of garbage? Or the exact opposite how can I improve my presentation skills? One of those feels really good to think about, at least to me, and one of those feels really bad to think about, like why am I such a loser? If you're put in a position where you're thinking thoughts like that, you're not happy, you're not doing well, that's not a good day. But something as simple as what could I do to improve my presentation skills? It's like okay, tell me more, I want to know.

Dan: 23:22

I want to know more about this, but but it's a lot easier to accept the thing. That takes a lot less time and effort, which is, well, I'm just a piece of junk and and I'm done with. Nobody's ever going to want me. I don't need to like invest any time and energy or in thinking that way, but I would improve my presentation skills. Okay, now you're just. You're at the tip of the iceberg. Now what, oh my gosh, how much work is this going to take?

Charles: 23:45

right? Yeah, it's definitely. I see why. A lot of it's fault the other. Yes, I do too.

Charles: 23:50

It's comforting to to just adopt the mindset at least it's comforting in the short term to adopt a mindset of there's nothing I could do. I did my best and I didn't get the outcome that I wanted. Right, woe is me that. There's something soothing about that, where it's like circumstances conspired against me. There was nothing I could have done differently. That's different from the other extreme is this was all my fault and it's up to me to completely change myself so this never happens to me again.

Charles: 24:21

There's a spot in the middle that says, okay, how much of this was under my control. What could I do to be incrementally better? Next time this comes up? Yeah, but that's where you're being the most objective and you're also looking at okay, so I've got to improve my presentation skills. What's the easiest part of my presentation to either a potential employer or a potential girlfriend? What's the easiest thing that I can change for the? Where do I get the most bang for my buck as far as investing in myself, like, what's shoes? Definitely shoes. It's all about the shoes, the shoes.

Charles: 24:57

But you can carry that metaphor in a lot of different directions, for sure. Okay, recognize the boundary that you hit and learn from it. So if someone gives you a no, they're setting a boundary and that's a good thing, because they're giving you information about them and the kind of relationship you have or would have with them. So recognize and and appreciate that they've communicated a boundary. Whenever somebody says essentially no, I don't agree to that, I don't consent to that, then they're telling you something about them that you can use going forward. And even if going forward means not having any more interactions with them, at least you've learned something about where their lines are.

Dan: 25:37

Yeah, as I've gotten older, I've realized.

Dan: 25:40

One of the things I've realized is that people are very scared or intimidated, or have habits of not communicating because of a number of different reasons whether they don't want to get people upset, whether they feel ashamed about what they have to say.

Dan: 25:56

And I've been in that boat as well, and I still am from time to time. And so anytime anybody communicates anything of difficulty to me, first thing I do is go thank you, like thank you for not making me work to try to figure out what the problem is or what's going on here, and thank you Also try, try to encourage, thank you for feeling that you can trust me enough to really tell me authentically how you feel, right, not feel like I'm gonna make you, make fun of you or judge you or whatever that is. Yeah, and as I've gotten old, I realize how valuable that is in somebody who's willing to trust me and willing to communicate with me, because those are things that a lot of people don't do. And, again, I just never even thought about it until, honestly, we started going through all these books on the podcast. But now anytime anybody in my life is willing to really open up with me and stuff like that. I try to remember to really praise that and encourage that.

Charles: 26:57

Yeah, that's important because if you are somebody who even if it's something I don't want to hear, especially if you don't want to, because that's what I was going to say it comes down to if you're always training people on how they should interact with you and while I would say it's never a hundred, if somebody decides to lie to you or not tell you the whole truth, that's never your fault. You're not making them be dishonest with you. However, if you're also training them that you're somebody who can't handle the truth, then you're teaching them the lesson of boy it might be. It'd probably be so much easier if I just didn't tell him that I ran into my ex-boyfriend when I was at the coffee shop today, because I know if I tell him, he's going to lose his mind about it and I'm going to hear him getting jealous and just blah, blah, blah, getting into his feelings and losing emotional self-control. So it'd be easier if I just didn't mention it. And so then, yeah, that's on you. You're the one that's teaching her.

Dan: 28:00

That's an easier way for her to be yeah, and you're setting yourself up for struggles down the road because now you don't know what the truth is. Right, and now you're going to start question things. And right, you're so resentful and you're subject to you almost did it to yourself, almost yourself. You're subject to her opinion. You almost did it to yourself, almost did it to yourself.

Charles: 28:16

You're subject to her opinion of what can this guy handle and what can this guy not handle, and she could get that right or she could get that wrong, but you're teaching her that it's in her interest to consider what can he handle, what can he not handle when? If you can handle everything with honesty and say things like what she offers here is I'm bummed, but I get it. No hard feelings. If you can say, if you get to the point where you say that honestly, then people feel like, okay, well, I can share anything with him and he's not going to pretend like it doesn't matter, nor is he going to explode, but he's going to be honest, no matter what, then that's somebody that can be told anything yeah and and it's tricky here, it's a fine line.

Dan: 28:59

Versus when you say handle, I think a lot of us think, all right, you put up a shield and it doesn't matter what she says. You right, you are almost a statue. You're like one of the guards outside the.

Dan: 29:09

You know the palace, right, and uh, yeah and and you're completely stoic and it doesn't matter, like everything bounces off of you. That's not. That's not good either it I think, like you said, it's important to say yeah, I'm upset. Don't be upset if you can find a way to like not be upset with her or right or whoever's telling you that, but it doesn't mean you need to hide your emotions about it either right, yeah, if you can, if you choose to be honest and say, hey, I you say no to this, or you sharing this truth with me.

Charles: 29:47

It upsets me, it bums me out, it disappoints me a little, but I understand where you're coming from and I'm not angry. If you can say that and mean that and your partner or anybody you're like just focuses on the part where you said, hey, it upset me and that triggers them and that upsets them and they can't handle you being honest about your feelings, then that's also a piece of information that you can leverage in deciding at what level you should be interacting with this person or not. And that's been a place where I have dropped the ball before in my previous relationships, where somebody would tell me hey, I'm upset because you said or did this, or I'm disappointed that you said or did this, and then I immediately go into defensive mode. That makes you a not great partner and it makes you a partner that's a little little harder to stick with, a little harder to work things out with than you would be otherwise. Yeah, and so being told that you did something upsetting is a skill that you have to develop if you want to have a partner who's honest with you about how they feel, and so that's another muscle that is pretty tough. I'd rather do triceps than work on that muscle.

Charles: 30:57

Okay, so she also shares a communication strategy called STFU, which normally we would ask for shut the F up. But in her case, or the person she got it from it stands for something else, or the person she got it from it stands for something else. It stands for share time, meaning when you're having an interaction with somebody, a conversation, try to be conscious of how much you're talking, how much you're listening, and don't let it go to extremes on either side, where they're the only one talking or they're the only one listening. Try to make sure that there's a balance there. The T stands for three seconds. Give others a chance to continue to speak or jump into the conversation before you begin to speak. So if there's a pause in the conversation, let it go for three seconds before you decide that it's your turn to talk. Yeah, because people could still be processing stuff Exactly. Yeah, yes, that's something that I need to work on. Yeah, me too. I was just talking to my girlfriend last night.

Dan: 31:56

I'm driving on the road. Oh wait, there's three feet of space between the two. I'm in there, I'm in there.

Charles: 32:03

Yeah, you and I on this show we interrupt each other frequently, but I believe in a way that works for us. I hope it doesn't cause stress for me, so I hope it doesn't cause stress for the listeners either.

Dan: 32:15

I hope it doesn't cause.

Charles: 32:15

It doesn't cause stress for me, so I hope it doesn't cause stress for the listeners either. Yeah, but you and I have a bit of a shorthand that we've developed, and it does include jumping in when the other person may not be completely done with their idea.

Dan: 32:25

Well, I think part of that might be like might be a comedy timing type of thing I don't know Our humor type of thing.

Charles: 32:31

I feel like sometimes I do that when, if I were to wait too long, like I might miss my window to, yeah, make my joke, yeah and I can't think of a radio show or a podcast with multiple hosts that don't also have some of that going on, all right to where they jump in a little on top of each other when they feel like it's worth it. Find empathy, that's what the f stands for. Really listen to people, not just the content, but their backstory, where are they coming from? And then this one really stood out to me Understanding is not necessary. Active listening is designed to help us better understand others, but that doesn't mean we always are successful at doing so. We've all had that what the hell? Moment in regard to someone else's worldview, and it's okay to accept it without getting it, and that's tough to be like. Okay, I think I've got a window into where you're coming from, but I'll never understand what you really mean. What?

Charles: 33:32

you really mean yeah, and especially if you get politics or religion into the conversation, it's very easy to say all right, I think I understand what's important to you on this subject, but I have no clue how you got there. You know, especially in an election year, that has definitely been a place I've been where it's like all right, I hear you telling me what your core values are. I have no idea why you landed on, why or how you would have landed on those, though yeah, sometimes logic is different for different people, I feel right, yeah, and sometimes even calling it logic feels like a stretch.

Charles: 34:10

But right, that's. Listen, every everybody has a mode that gets them to where they think they need to be, and we don't have to understand it. I would say we don't even have to respect it. I believe in respecting people, but not bending over backwards. To respect ideas, yeah, what? What do you define respecting ideas as? Give me an example of that, because to me, when you say that, I'm thinking it's not making.

Charles: 35:01

If somebody says, deep down between you and me, I don't know that this group of people really should have a right to vote in this country, oh, okay. And then I'm going to say, okay, I understand, that's your opinion and that's about as far as I'm going to say okay, I, I, I understand that's your opinion and that's about as far as I'm going to go. I respect that person. Is has agency, and I granted them the dignity of saying you have a right to hold any opinion that you want to. Yeah, and until the point where you're trying to enact policies based on these ideas, I'm okay with you being wrong about whatever you like. Yeah, and that's the thing it's like.

Charles: 35:46

I'm okay with people when it comes to just sitting around the Thanksgiving table or sitting around the table at a restaurant or a bar. It's like you're allowed to have whatever wrong opinions you want to have. Now, when you decide to file your papers to run for Congress, then I'm going to be a little bit more vocal with my opposition to your screwed up ideas. But as long as you're just somebody's crazy uncle sitting around the Thanksgiving table, got it, hey, good luck. You can feel whatever crazy thing you want to feel. I'm not gonna. I'm not gonna say shame on you. You're not allowed to feel that way. Yeah, so I will respect yeah your personhood.

Charles: 36:21

Yeah, I'm not gonna jump in and say that idea has merit. You're really onto something, yeah I'll be honest with you.

Dan: 36:27

It does make it then tough to respect the person when the ideas are. If it was that extreme, I guess. When it is that extreme, yeah, right, yeah, what level are we talking about?

Charles: 36:39

yes, yeah, when it comes down to, because of your demographics or your lifestyle, I don't think you should get to vote. I don't think you should get to be a citizen, I don't think you should get to exist. That is like, yeah, okay, I recognize that you're allowed to have those opinions, but we're probably I'm probably not picking up the phone and asking you to hang out, right, yeah, because I don't want to.

Dan: 37:03

So that's where I Recognize that you're not getting another invite to Thanksgiving dinner.

Charles: 37:08

Yeah, exactly, or Thanksgiving day or Christmas day That'd be a great time for me to schedule a vacation. Yeah, so that I'm the one who removes myself.

Dan: 37:20

It's funny how that's always like the most commonly used Litmus test for that Right is Thanksgiving dinner, right. And it's so funny, like our sense of social obligation, to invite people who seem to be just so different in our opinions and ideas of ourselves. It seems to be, oh, we're going to bypass all of that and feel like we have to invite them to Thanksgiving dinner, even though they might be on a different freaking planet.

Charles: 37:45

Yeah, and that's tough for me, because when I'm in those situations, if somebody brings up a topic that I didn't bring up and then they bring it up in a way that really it's not, I want to have this discussion. It's I want to crowbar my political or religious ideas into this meeting that we're, this gathering that we're currently having.

Charles: 38:08

I believe that was the high conflict personality that dr faith was talking about yeah, look, right now it's like okay, if you're gonna open this, walk through it. I'm not just going to pretend that I didn't see you open the door and walk through it. I'm going to respond to it and usually at my best, I'll lead with something like look, I see this quite a bit differently than you do. Are you capable of having a conversation, or do you think if, if I disagree with you, are you going to get upset?

Charles: 38:40

yeah I feel like that's gonna and well, to be completely honest, even that is a shitty rhetorical technique on my part, because who's gonna say I can't handle exactly? I can't handle defending this position.

Charles: 38:53

Okay, you want some of this, you're literally like, yeah, it's baiting, it's me baiting the corner where they say, oh no, of course I could, I can debate my ideas dispassionately and then I proceed to, yeah, launch the nukes. That's tough, that's that's yeah. So I I started by saying at my best, no, but really it's at my worst that I do that, where what I really should do is just ignore it or, if it's crazy enough, I should just get up and leave.

Dan: 39:20

Again, right, yeah, I think it's what's on the line here. If they're saying they're going to run for county commissioner or office or something like that, then at that point might be worth opening up that can of worms, but otherwise, if it's just your crazy uncle.

Charles: 39:37

Yeah, then you could just leave it as either. Do the gray rock approach where you're like, okay, yeah, yeah and not go any further. Right, because they're clearly looking for something if a brain get out of note, exactly yeah, or saying something pseudo condescending like that's certainly an opinion people have, which I've said stuff like that before. Yeah, when I didn't want to get into it with somebody.

Dan: 39:56

Yeah.

Charles: 39:57

And then if they're like well, what do you think? It's like, well, do you really want to know, or do you you don't want to know what? I say, yeah, Can't handle it for me, yeah, all right. Well, that's where we are for that chapter. On the next one, we're going to get into how do we hold ourselves accountable for boundary violations, and that's a little tougher one. So this will be a good one to get into, but let's stop there for now sounds good, and we'll talk to you more next time, dan. Bye-bye. Thank you for listening to the entire episode. We appreciate it. Check out mindfullymasculinecom for any info we are willing and able to share in our full audio and video episodes.