Mindfully Masculine: Personal Growth and Mental Health for Men
Charles and Dan are just two guys talking about relationships, masculinity, and authenticity. Join them as they discuss books and media, as well as their (sometimes messy) personal stories, to encourage men to join the fight for their mental, physical, and emotional health--because a world of healthy, resilient men is a thriving and more secure world for everyone.
Mindfully Masculine: Personal Growth and Mental Health for Men
The White Lotus: Control, Collapse, and Consequence
⚠️ Season 3 finale spoilers ahead! Plus content note for frank discussions of murder, suicide, and murder-suicide.
In this final episode of Mindfully Masculine’s deep dive into The White Lotus, Season 3, Charles and Dan unpack the unraveling masculinity on full display in the finale. From Timothy’s narcissistic delusions of control 🧠, to Rick’s self-destructive spiral disguised as vengeance 🔫, to Gaitok’s late-game moral compromise 🤐—this one’s about what happens when fragile egos try to play God.
We ask: What does “protecting your family” really mean? When does suffering become selfish? And how do men like Saxon learn—too late—that performance won’t earn them real connection?
Also in the mix:
– Why Piper’s breakdown is more honest than it looks 😭
– What happens when someone finally runs toward Rick (instead of away) 🏃♀️💔
– And why we’ll never stop talking about that blender 🥤
Find full audio and video episodes at mindfullymasculine.com—and stick around, because next up we’re diving into The Let Them Theory by Mel Robbins. 📘
I would just say a deeper connection is what he sees that she has the potential for, yeah, and now he wants that and he's not going to get it with her because she already thinks she has it with Rick Right. Welcome to the Mindfully Masculine Podcast. This is Charles, and you are listening to our final episode in our series exploring the White Lotus, season 3, through the lens of masculinity, identity and emotional truth. Quick note before we start, you might hear some audio hiccups or just bad audio, mostly my microphone. Thanks for hanging in there. The good news is we've got it resolved and the better news is I had to buy some new gadgets to make it better, so win-win. As always, spoiler alert. Alert. We're going to talk about the finale, so if you haven't finished the season, you might want to come back later. And also we're going to talk about themes of murder and suicide and murder suicide. So if that feels a little too heavy to listen to right now, or your kids in the car, relax, come back later and let's get into it. About it, I?
Dan:loved it. I thought it was an amazing way to wrap it up.
Charles:Well done it was. But oh, it made me angry, so angry at so many people oh, do tell who.
Dan:Who made you the angriest. I should ask, let's start off voice it's.
Charles:It's a tough call between rick and timothy. I really needed both of them for what they did in this episode. Okay, but yeah, I guess we'll. We'll go down the list and start with the start, with the rattleth family first, yeah, and then we'll brick and guy talk at the end. So yeah, I mean we, we hit on, hit on some of it. Once timothy started having the murder fantasy, the murder-suicide fantasies, I was pretty angry at him. And then, as he Cool question.
Dan:Yeah, were you more angry once he had the murder. Part of that Was the suicide just okay. Or did it make you angrier to think that he's now going to take his family?
Charles:out too. Oh, no, definitely the murder part of it. Yeah, suicide, Right, look, I mean mean, suicide is certainly a bad thing. That I, I hope doesn't happen to people. But yeah, listen, if somebody decides I don't have a way out and they want to do that, I'm not. I'm not one of these people that looks yeah on them or gets angry at them or how dare they? That's selfish. I, I don't buy into any of that bullshit when it comes to suicide, people, people commit suicide because they feel like they have no other option and they're compelled to do it, and so the me being angry about that does not make the situation that led to it any better or any different. So, yeah, yeah, no.
Charles:If he if he wanted to, I mean, kill himself, I think yes, it would be. There would be negative consequences on his family that he probably wouldn't be considering if he killed himself. But look, when you're, when you're in crisis, by definition your thoughts are and your feelings are very self-centered, because you feel like you're in the middle of something that's worse than dying, yeah, and so being able, like having the capability to consider how your actions are going to affect other people, just doesn't really factor in when you think things are that bad. So anyway, I get that. But no, what makes me angry is him defaulting to. I am going to decide that my family would be better off dead than alive, and so I'm going gonna make that choice for them. That's, that's the part that gets me.
Dan:Yeah, furious little little arrogant, little little narcissistic. Little little arrogant, little little narcissistic.
Charles:Yeah, if you think about it yeah, I mean, is there a more narcissistic act than, oh my god, deciding that I know you can't handle this whole child going to kill you, so you don't have to? I mean that really, yeah, there's, that's very pathological. So, and and even when his daughter was talking about her decision to not stay at the dormitory- or the meditation center.
Charles:Yeah, the bottom line is, when you really think about it, there's almost no scenario where her life in North Carolina is even going to be as bad as living in the meditation center. Oh yeah, like whatever they think their rock bottom is in north carolina after dad's arrested and in minimum security. Like what? What they think is poor and having nothing. Compare you what the world views as being poor and having nothing. It's not even the same right. So yeah, for them it's. It's maybe living in a shitty three-bedroom apartment did a bad neighborhood in raleigh or durham or something like that. Like that's, that's what they would consider.
Charles:Having nothing, yeah, because at the end of the day, the the government is not literally going to take away every possession that the family has ever owned. It's not. It's not going to be that it's going to be. They're probably coming out of this with a small Fifteen hundred square foot three bedroom, two bath in a lower end subdivision in the same town they live in and Timothy isn't coming out of prison with a little tear tattooed on the side of his arm right Like yeah.
Dan:Right yeah so maybe, yeah, and didn't you say the lawyer's like, oh, like was it like 13 months or something, or was it like four, it was like six months, six months or something like that, right, yeah, in a minimum security prison, right.
Charles:And he was just like I'd rather die.
Charles:Maybe they didn't say minimum security, no, but I'm in that, but I'm probably right yeah so right, and yeah, and the licenses that he could sell or that he could have to sell securities are probably, yeah, there's gonna be some things that he's not gonna be able to do, but there are probably other things in the financial services space. I mean, is he going to be a felon? Maybe he is, maybe he's not. I mean, I think if you're sentenced to a year or more in prison, you're automatically a felon. Oh, I didn't know that If you're convicted of a felony, it means that you have to do. I don't think that's true, that you have to do a year in prison, no matter what.
Charles:I think there are people who get convicted of felonies. So, yeah, I mean shit. The president of the United States, right? I mean, he was convicted of 34 or 36 felonies in New York and he's not getting sentenced at all. So yeah, there's nothing that says if you're a felon, you have to go to jail, or if you go to jail, you have to be a felon.
Charles:So yeah, he could probably plead his way out of this. I mean, sticking around in Thailand for the full week, even though he knew this was going on, probably isn't going to help his case. It's probably not going to destroy his case either isn't going to help his case, so it's probably not going to destroy his case either. So I don't know what what his life looks like after this, but it's certainly not living the life of a poor person in asia or africa. It's. It's living the life of a poor person in america, which obviously, you know, with considering other factors, might not be great, but it's. It's not living the life of a poor person in Asia or Africa. It's just not. So, yeah, I think.
Dan:As Piper found what she did Correct. I mean, did it have organic vegetables?
Charles:Yeah, and it's easy to cut your eyes at her, but the part of it and I did, the reason I rolled my eyes at her, was not because she tried this experience out and she was like this is not for me, because I've tried out a lot of experiences where I'm like, if this is not for me, I'm giving up. But I did not make my. The eye-rolling part with her is she made her identity kind of. I'm better than this comfortable lifestyle that I'm in. I have my sights set on higher things. And then when she tried it, she was like, oh, I can't do it, so it's.
Charles:It's really how you go into the experience that gets people to be like, oh, okay, Blah, blah, blah. It's not the fact that I'm open to this, it blah, blah, blah. It's not the fact that, hey, I'm open to this, it's right. It's like the fact that I'm open to this makes me better than you. Is that 100%? That was the vibe she put off for the whole thesis. Absolutely, and I can understand, yeah, thinking that way Until you actually do it Right. But then you're confronted with the reality of what it is you're signing up for and you're like, oh no, this is not what and and I and I think it was I like that she had a bit of I feel guilty now because I thought that I was up for this and now that I'm not like that made her human. But yeah, it was.
Dan:And the guilt that she felt like for all the things that they have Right and and right.
Charles:So absolutely. But yeah, the mother's reaction to that was she was hysterical. Yeah, like so funny, just the I. I. When I watched it the first time I thought she might say something like yes, we're lucky, we have more than kings and queens, and that's all true. Like somebody who's well off in america has a life better, like it would be unrecognizable to the king of england a hundred years ago. A hundred percent. And even a poor person in america has access to stuff that I that the king of england 100 years ago would be like a three-bedroom apartment in raleigh absolutely.
Charles:Yes, you probably lived in a three-bedroom apartment. You lived a kind of life. It's. The rattle will kill himself over dan hey, I had the air conditioning.
Dan:I was a happy camper.
Charles:That's all I needed, honestly so I talk about that all the time.
Dan:So the non-issue, the crippled mattress, I'm good so in that vein, the mom was basically saying, yeah, we, we got it so good, it would be offensive if we didn't enjoy it and it was. And then when, when piper's breaking down and she's the mom is is coddling her and hugging her or whatever, and she turns to Timothy and gives him the thumbs up, like, yeah, she realized that she can't go and so now she's going to stay home with us.
Charles:Yeah, where Timothy's thinking well, now I guess she's going to die too. Yep, exactly.
Dan:Because he was just like yeah, he was really trying. He was like hey, it shows that we can live without all this stuff. And the mom turns ghost white like what are you saying, right? And then that's when the daughter breaks down. And then they show timothy's face and he's just like it's like, oh shit, yeah, even my daughter, who?
Charles:yeah, she's got a she. She's better off dead too. Yeah, yeah, I where I where I hoped at the bottom the mother might go to. The least we could do is be grateful, or I thought you'd say something about gratitude, not just basically we gotta have fun. I mean, there's a big difference enjoying something and be grateful for something but that I mean that was perfect for that character.
Dan:Yeah, it was absolutely hysterical.
Charles:Yeah, so he. He changes his mind on the murder-suicide plot at the last possible moment. I mean, they're already drinking the poison that he believes is going to kill all of them.
Dan:Right, so yeah, to back up, he talks to Pam and Pam's like oh yeah, remember these fruits how to poison the seeds. They call it a suicide tree because people often grind it up and grind up the seeds and drink it to or eat it to kill themselves. And he's. And then so his mind starts, starts going oh, all right Anymore.
Charles:So I need something else. And yeah, the there was so much, so much foreshadowing the design. There is additionally five shadowy. I mean it was really over a little bit, was over the top.
Dan:So it's interesting, yeah, so seriously, yeah. So he sits down with Lockie and he comes back and he's just like, hey, lock, he's like, could you live without any money? And he goes, I mean no money, like no house, nothing. And Lockie's like, yeah, I think I could, and then it was literally the thing.
Charles:And then that's what I hated.
Dan:Oh you the right answer. So you get to live. That was part of what made me angry. Yeah, right, and he was just like, okay, and so you're gonna live. And when he talks about going back after dinner to make, to make pina coladas back in the back in the bungalow with the family lock, he asked him like oh, I've never had a pina colada. And he's like, well, you're not gonna have one now, you're having a coke you're not 21, you're not 21, and it was just like his way of saving them, right?
Charles:yeah, which was also, I mean, perfect, perfectly ironic. Yes, and there was some controversy online the idea of who would find a blender with remnants of a protein shake and then just add more and make a new protein shake. I, I agree, right, that was gross oh, maybe I'd maybe listen.
Dan:Maybe an 18 year old kid because I've done stupid shit at 18 too Like not thinking about like, and maybe here's the other thing too is so here's the other thing, yeah, maybe. So here's the other thing. Dad was denying Lockie really wanted to have that pina colada. He never had he didn't because there was like alcohol in it or whatever. So maybe he was thinking oh, there's a little bit of that pina colada left in there. I'll get a little taste of it in my protein shake.
Charles:The coconut milk has turned right. I mean, he was there for the dramatic slapping of the glass away. Oh, good point. Not only is it pina colada mixed from last night, but it's crappy coconut. Coconut milk is rancid or something like that's a good point, yeah, yeah and so I mean listen, when I was 18 I would never have found the remnants of an of a night old. Oh yeah, I mean friday.
Dan:I thought, well, maybe he thought satsum made a protein shake that morning and just didn't wash the blender oh, that's like even that's still gross well, they did have that scene where saxon basically is like oh lucky yeah, if you make a little drink here but I make, make your own, you gotta. Nobody's gonna make you a man nobody's gonna make you a man and and the stuff's on the counter right but that was the day before. Oh, that was the day before the night. Oh, you're right. Okay, I'm sorry, okay.
Charles:so yeah, maybe maybe he didn't think, oh, oh, that's the leftover pina coladas. Maybe he bought sacks and made a protein shake and he needed to clean the blender. Still gross? I still wouldn't do it. If I find a blender with anything in it, I'm washing it out before I make my thing. Even when I was 18, I would not drink out of a dirty glen. So here's the thing. We should definitely spend 40 or 50 minutes on this. We should no.
Dan:I probably would have at 18. If I was in my family, if I knew it was only my family that was there, that was like making food and stuff like that. Listen, I probably still would have washed it out. But to me it's a little bit more of a viable scenario for him to have not washed it out If he knew it was only his family and he he kind of got intimate with with other fluids from from his brother.
Dan:So why, why, why, why stop? This is? This is mild compared to the usual fluid that he's used to.
Charles:Well, I'll let you back on that Cause he's not even thinking. He's drinking after his brother. He's thinking his brother.
Dan:Right, right right.
Charles:Stuffed in there and then poured it into the glass and then just left some of the yeah Gross I would not find the remnants of a protein shake and add to it. But anyway I didn't really have. I did feel like letting him live. It made sense Because he was having a very small, weakened dose of whatever the poison plant was and and generally speaking, there's not a ton of naturally occurring plants that are poisonous that will actually kill you. For the most part it's you get really sick and then you still survive unless you really concentrate up the stuff. So it made sense that he would get sick and then be okay. But nothing against Lachlan. But part of me almost wanted the dad to have to live with killing his son over when he didn't want to. Part of me thought that would serve him right for him to yeah, one person he wanted to save. He is the one that he ended up killing well.
Charles:So, in all fairness, I did feel like the dad did take away a lesson that maybe money isn't everything yeah, it still felt a little under to me, like like he didn't like for even thinking about and starting to implement the process of murdering his family, that he didn't suffer enough in my opinion, like I wanted to see down. And again, I'm nothing against lock on, I'm okay with him surviving, I'm glad he survived a special character. But it would have been something to me the dad, hey, a little bit for, yeah, what he was thinking, right, losing all the stuff's not enough. I wanted, I wanted to suffer or think about killing the stanley, and so I didn't. I didn't quite get that and that's one of the things that looked. I like teaching lessons too. I know you do.
Dan:I know you do that's a bit rough, but yeah, I get it.
Charles:I get it all right, let's talk about the older son. We've kind of covered the younger one pretty much in detail. The older one yeah, basically he found out that his Did he go to Duke? Yeah, couldn't tell, he hadn't mentioned it. I think that he got a little bit of a lesson himself in. Okay, what's the long-term result of playing this character? Like playing the character he's playing and I'm gonna talk about the actor I'm talking about saxo, playing this alpha male finance bro. It will probably work for him to get all the things he kind of wants, but not not the things he really wants or the things he really needs from other people. So he'll get some of the trappings of being a finance bro, but in this episode, a girl like Chelsea, or Chelsea specifically.
Dan:He kind of realized, oh, this act is not going to do anything to get someone who is good enough to not want me yeah, it's very symbolic when chelsea he's talking to chelsea, sitting there as he's, he tries to press her by reading that meditation book or the book I'm wasn't a meditation, but it was one of the books that was she and and she's like oh you gotta read a lot more.
Dan:She's like, oh, you got to read a lot more. She's amazing. And then she talks about how they might be. One of the author's philosophies is that we're all in different groups spiritual groups and we might be in the same group and not even realize it. And just as he starts to really, I think, feel an attraction for her and connect to her, she sees Rick on the beach who finally returns from partying with frank and almost killing it, killing the yeah the, you know the guy, the guy, and she runs and takes off and then you could just see it in saxon's face.
Dan:I kind of like, oh, I'm like I didn't get what I wanted.
Charles:Yeah, that's that. Image of him, of him, went fairly viral. Yeah, because, yeah, he, he looked crushed when she got up and ran direct and and, like you said, that's, that's something maybe he wants now right that like unconditional, but we we've already established that this, or think of that, dan or the appearance of that unconditional I would just say a a deeper connection is is what?
Charles:what he sees that she has the potential for, yeah, and now he wants that and he's not going to get it with her because she already thinks she has it with Rick. Right, it did remind me. It is very nice when a girl runs up to hug you.
Dan:It was an amazing scene. Yes, it's such a good feeling To me, it's like. To me it feels. Yes, I agree there's no such thing as unconditional love, but her behavior throughout the series I feel like was very close to oh my God, I can't believe you're putting up with this crap from this asshole Rick and you're still loving him more and more and more. To me, that's about as close as you can get to unconditional love.
Charles:Yeah, but you know you're talking about it that way. It makes it like unconditional love is the perfect thing that we should all shoot for. She got close to it. No, no, no. Unconditional love I'm not saying it's perfect, I think because it exists is not the good. No, no, no For love that seems like unconditional love is not what we want. What we want is to understand exactly what we're bringing and what we're expecting, absolutely. And so the put up was so much probably out of her lack of health, not because of her profound mental health, like a healthy person would not be in that relationship with Rick right off with his bullshit.
Dan:And I'm not saying that's the idea. What I'm saying is it's a quick moment of a dopamine fix of joy for Rick when, when he sees somebody coming up to him, oh yeah, running across the beach and going, oh my god, oh my god, oh my god she wrote herself into his arm. I'm not seeing this in the ideal right, but it's. We all enjoy our little dopamine fixes of everything. Why is it having to run up for you and he's?
Charles:talking about one of those a hundred percent. Yeah, it feels great, yeah, but yeah, so, yeah, saxon, I mean, he may be. He may be more able to roll with the situation that his dad has brought on the family, knowing he's had this experience with chelsea. I don't know, yeah, could be. We'll probably never know, we'll never. I don't think mike white's gonna revisit any of the rat lips. He might, but I don't think it's gonna happen. Yeah, those obvious was a different season.
Dan:I'm gonna click with people I am so hopeful for the idea of what the mom was.
Dan:Such a character for me, so funny with like her her, her out of the out of her mind, like arrogance and living in a different world, which is so funny to me and some of the things that she said. I would love to see her in that, with that mindset, in a a three-bedroom apartment in raleigh or or working at the next white lotus hotel, right as as like a front desk person or the help or whatever, a maid or something. Oh my god, that would be hysterical.
Charles:I would be like that's too too much. Yeah, the maid would be a little too much. Any of that would be a little kitschy, I think. Yeah, maybe I don't. I don't think. I rather would have the unanswered questions like I don't want to. I don't want to fight with pretty soprano when they painted to black.
Dan:Yeah, I don't know I'd rather make up in my own. I disagree with the soprano thing. I hated that ending, did really hate it.
Charles:So many like yeah, I feel like I loved it, I felt like it was a cop-out, like you just did not, or the writers did not want to put some juice into this and at least do a little bit of of additional tie-ups see, I I appreciate the ambiguous endings, like I think you can make it ambiguous, but just did you like the ending to where it pulls away on the top setting and it doesn't show the top all over, but it shows a wobble a little bit. So we don't know if he's really in a dream or if he's in the real world. Or did you not even know that was what was going on?
Dan:I didn't even know that was going on. So I'll be honest with you I don't remember Inception.
Charles:It's worth a rewatch. I watched it not too long ago and it's still one of the best movies ever.
Dan:All right, I'll add that to my list, because I don't remember that scene.
Charles:Yeah, the very last scene of the movie is before he walks out to meet his kids. He spins the top, oh okay, and you kind of see him meeting the kids, but then it focuses on the top and the top is still spinning. There you're meeting the kids, but then it focuses on the top and the top is still spinning.
Dan:There's a little bit of a wobble, but it doesn't fall over.
Charles:Is he in the real world yet, or is he still a dream? That's okay.
Dan:The Soprano thing, I think was just a cop.
Charles:I think that was just interesting. See, I thought, did you like the way Lost ended? See, I thought they answered too many questions on Lost. I thought they answered too many questions I lost. I thought they should have left more stuff ambiguous. I thought they tied up everything a little too neatly in my opinion.
Charles:I'd rather go that direction then yeah, yeah, not me, I like it the other way, yeah, okay. So yeah, let's talk about Rick. So Rick, I guess, stays up all night with his friend in that crazy party just kind of watching him, and then decides okay, I gotta go. And the typical, typical, frank was typical drunk guy move of you can't leave. If you leave then my party's over, so you gotta stay here. It's like I, I don't know anybody likes I hate. I hate people like that. I yeah, that is. That's the worst.
Dan:I think we my group of friends back in the day we definitely helped promote the what they call the Irish exit. Yes, where we just leave, we don't say anything to anybody.
Charles:So our friend Richard's a master of. He's really good at the Irish exit. I mean Just walk out.
Dan:It's so many. So many people would do it Because we give so much shit to anybody.
Charles:He introduced me to the term Irish exit. I don't think I heard it until Richard. Yeah, heard it until richard. Yeah, I don't even know the history. I know the.
Dan:I know the term. Yeah, how is that why?
Charles:is it an irish exit? I don't know, but it's great, I and I. I like engaging it myself. Yes, yeah, because I, I don't, I don't. Oh, come on, I don't want to leave, I leave.
Charles:So, anyway, yeah, he, he leaves, he goes back to to the resort. He meets his girlfriend on the beach, tells her that he got the monkey off his back, which was again the level of foreshadowing there. Whenever people with broken brains come up with solutions, you've always got to remember the same brain that got you into trouble is the brain that is giving you the idea for how to get out. That's all I could think about with rick was he's got all these plans for how he's going to solve his own problem, but the problem only exists in his head, and using that head to come up with the way to get out of the problem, to solve the problem. So, finding this guy and engaging in the whole caper, pretending to be somebody else and lying to the wife and arranging the meeting and then knocking the guy out of his chair and acting like he's going to and if you remember that scene when he was talking to the guy, he talked at him.
Dan:He didn't ask any questions, he didn't really get any, he dug a little bit about life.
Charles:He thought the guy murdered his father, so he's not Right, but he.
Dan:True, murdered his father, so he's not right but he would true. But based on, like I mean, his mom said something to him. I feel like I mean, look, if, if you're willing to, I guess, get into that state of mind, to go all the way there, whatever you're right, you're not, you're not open to any new information and you're not looking for new information. So it makes, I mean, it lines up. I mean, I think I think they did an amazing job of keeping the characters very much aligned with their, or consistent throughout the story.
Charles:There's one character they did not do that with and, uh, we'll get to that, but a part of it is yeah, so so r in the last episode, rick does his confrontation in a suboptimal way, certainly, and then when the guy shows up at the hotel, confronts Rick. He also didn't have to be that much of a prick. He's also cruising for a bruising because he didn't need to confront Rick that way. It could have been like well, remember, that's true, they're our father. We find out in the end they're father and son, right, and this guy could still we don't know, he could still be a murderer. He could have the guy Rick thought was his dad. Absolutely, it seems like this guy could have.
Dan:But ironically, if you hear him, he talks shit about himself. He's just like your father was no saint. He's just like he was. You didn't miss out on much, kid. I didn't think about, yes, father, but he no. So no, he was basically talking about himself, right, because he's the father and he's just like. He's like yeah, I, I mean I, I knew your mother, yeah, call it a whore. And so I I knew she was a slut, but I didn't know she was a liar. And then Rick's like and he's just like trust me, kid, your father was no saint. And he's like and you didn't miss out on much.
Charles:Yeah, that didn't occur to me. Yeah, oh, yeah, yeah, which is huge he could have. Yeah, if he just he could have gotten that information to the guy a different way. But he was angry because he, rick, had alpha dogged him and he felt bad about that.
Dan:Yeah, so I mean, maybe it's a little bit of, I mean, or a lot of a lot of Rick in this old or the or the older guys in Rick. Oh yeah, right, so it, I mean, like I said, perfect, I think, really well done, really thought out, really thought out, well thought out in terms of the character development there yeah, but it does.
Charles:I mean, based on the choices that they each made, they both kind of got what was coming to them. I mean, I don't think it was okay for rick to kill the guy and I don't think it was. The circumstances under which rick died were not okay either, which we'll talk about in a second. Yeah, but it's like, man, you do, you reap what you sow. I mean you, you live a life of violence and alpha dogging and acting that way, and pretty soon you're going to act that way with somebody who's like I'm not here for this bullshit and I'm gonna snap. And it just keeps escalating. Yeah, exactly at that point until, yeah, I, I think rick was mainly focused on the insult to his mother. That was the thing that got him so angry that he goes off and, to his credit, seeks a session with the meditation lady, which I think she could have done a little bit better job of reading the room. Oh for sure, yeah, hey, I got to. Yeah, we're going to be late. I got to gotta.
Dan:I gotta address this good point and she was basically saying, right before rick left, was basically begging him for another session and saying you've really moved me right and so now, all of a sudden, oh, he's not so important, even though he's like coming to her in a moment of distress. Well, I gotta stick to the schedule where he's on there walking yeah, I feel like, okay, look this.
Charles:Yeah, this guy's coming to you begging you for a session to get into some stuff, because he's very bothered and it's like no, this other guest already has me on the. It's like, at that point, fuck your job, you're, you're the one person that this guy and so you seem that you feel like you have a connection to, you're the one person that can probably help him. And you're gonna be like I don't wanna, don't want to inconvenience this other employee's son who's getting a free session probably. Yeah, come on.
Dan:That's a little all right, it's good point.
Charles:So she basically caused all this, all her fault all her fault, I think, but I think she, she, yeah, she had a vibe for what was going on, and zion was there for a recreational meditation session, not not any kind of a crisis. So, yeah, I, and it was the first session she had with him too, correct, so? And she could have said hey, as the son of about one of my co-workers, this guy's having an issue right now. Can we, can we delay this a little bit? Apparently she had the next hour after zion completely free, because that's when she was telling rick to come back right though. Hey, would it be too much trouble if you wouldn't mind? Can we just swap? Yeah, if that happened then yeah, I'm not saying it's her fault, but yeah, no, no shootout occurs if that happens. So that was kind of.
Dan:Or it could be fitting. For look, rick, you've now your behavior and your actions have led you to also experience some a little bit less luck than an average bear because of your behavior. I mean, I really believe the how you, how you act on to on a regular basis. It's going to either attract or repel things to you. Yeah, I can see karma is an actual thing, but I'm going to say, yeah, it's. Uh. I'm going to say you're going to attract better things to you, depending depending on how your attitude is, or worse things to you, depending on what your attitude is, or worse things to you, depending on what your attitude is.
Charles:I do believe in a law of attraction yeah, like when things happen and you make bad things happen and hopefully when it comes to future events.
Dan:So you say so when you make something happen, you think there's no ripple effect. There's no other things that that impacts in the world. When you make something else happen, good or bad, there's no, there's no, there's no ripple effect. There's no boomerang that ever comes back that you could possibly interact with. I mean based on like a butterfly effect. Right, Probably Do you believe in a butterfly effect?
Charles:I believe that free will is a myth and that everything that is going to happen, everything that wasn't going to happen from the moment of the big bang, is just going to happen, okay, and that, uh, we, we participate in it, but we don't write the story. The story has already been written, so it doesn't matter what our actions are, it's that's predetermined. I mean, our actions do matter in that, given the ability to make choices, what choices we're going to make has already been decided, but we still make the choices. So then, really, it doesn't matter. I mean, I don't think it changes the end result of when entropy claims the last star and the lights of the universe go out. Whether we get our meditation session at one o'clock pm or two o'clock pm is not going to nick a deer okay, I mean, I can, I mean maybe yeah so, okay, yes, I, I do think that.
Charles:But you know what? What we, the choices we make, will be determined in part by what we're exposed to, and so, yeah, I, you know, we could talk a long time, on course, yeah, some of the I think that good people don't get good things because they deserve them, because the universe decides they deserve them, and bad people don't get bad things because the universe decides they deserve bad things. Okay, I don't see any kind of math that works out that way. I mean, I think plenty of bad people can do bad things and end up with the very nicest things, and plenty of good people can do good things and end up with the worst things, and I think that that happens randomly enough, that, yeah, a force like god's will or karma or whatever, is not something that should ever be planned on or banked on, like when things are going.
Charles:Yeah, you have the attitude of, well, if I just do the right thing long enough, then good things will come my way. I don't think there's really any evidence. So I think you should do the right thing, because it aligns with your values and you believe there's, so there's a reason. I completely do that, but, like, I do the right thing long enough, then my time will come and I'll get the good things I deserve. No, you won't, or you might, but it's not.
Dan:It's not related.
Charles:You're saying that's completely random. I think for the most part it's random.
Dan:Okay.
Charles:Okay, I mean, but look, there are decisions you can. There are decisions you make that will affect you your life, you can. There are decisions you make that will affect you your life, and if you're constantly hanging out in neighborhoods and in places where lots of crime occurs, then there's a higher chance that you will be a victim of crime, and so in that way, yes, what you are putting out there does have an effect on you. Right, my and my.
Dan:That's that's kind of where those concrete terms are, where it ends for me yeah, I mean, I don't think you can bank on any of that, right Like I don't believe that it's a given. It's like a mutable law that you do good things, you do bad things. The reciprocal is going to happen. But I think the odds are more likely that if you're putting good things out there, good things will come back to you. Put bad things out there, bad things will come back to you. Put bad things out there, bad things will come back to you. And so why not play the odds?
Charles:That's the way I look at it. I mean, I think if you put good things out there, it's because you're a person who focuses on good things, and focusing on good things will influence your thoughts and your actions so that you make those good things happen. Actions, so that you make those good things happen. Like if you, if you focus on I need to save up money for this financial goal, then you will consciously or unconsciously look for opportunities to save money toward that goal and it might end up happening for you faster than you initially thought that it would happen. Ultimately, that's still because of the actions and the thoughts that you're having. Yeah, not because somebody is pushing things in those directions for you. Yeah, yeah.
Charles:So I mean, we may be maybe a distinction without a difference.
Dan:Yeah, I think, I think we're kind of saying almost the same thing, but yeah.
Charles:All right.
Charles:So, anyway, rick Owl was coming to him.
Charles:I mean, he, he crafted this, this terrible outcome for himself and for Chelsea through his action, his inaction I mean predominantly the inaction, because he was a guy who looked our age or older, so he had a lot of time to deal with this shit.
Charles:And I've been a guy who has suffered and does suffer consequences for, okay, some negative stuff happened to me and that wasn't my fault, but the daily choice of not doing anything to address how it affected me or how I feel about it that's causing real world consequences, that ripple, and Rick could have decided not to spend his 50 years he looked like he was about 50, right, yeah, maybe a little older. Yeah, he could have decided to not spend all that time being angry and dwelling on the bad stuff that happened to him and and trying to work his way through that with, with therapy, with support groups, with whatever resources he, a man of his financial means, could have found. But he chose not to do that. Yeah, he chose to kind of wallow and enjoy time with his young, hot British girlfriend, when he even had the capability to enjoy that time.
Charles:Yeah, I didn't see much of that, not at all right. So, yeah, it looked like his primary vocation, 24-7, was being miserable about his childhood and then, when she booked meditation sessions for him, he begrudgingly went and participated at a very low level. So, yeah, ultimately it was his lack of action that led to this, which was not making the choice of hey. Being a miserable prick for 50 years isn't working for me. I need to try something else. But he never did that.
Charles:And then he came out. His broken brain came up with this caper of how he could make all his problems go away by yelling at or killing this bad man that did bad things to him 50 years ago. And, shocker, it didn't work out. So he dies and his girlfriend dies. He died, his girlfriend died because he got in a firefight with her standing a few feet behind him, which again not a good way to provide for the people you care about getting into gunfights while they're standing behind you yeah, if you're in gunfights, I mean, do it, do it on your own time yeah, and try to try to do it.
Dan:Don't make it data, exactly, exactly he did try to tell, he did say, get out of here. But I mean, then he turns right around and then, and so she she's not gonna. She wants to see what the hell she cares about him. She wants to see what she's gonna do.
Charles:So he cared more about put a few rounds into this guy than he did about protecting the woman he supposedly loved for sure. And so, yeah, that is not the version of any kind of masculinity that I like to see. I've got to settle the score at all costs. Meanwhile, that involves a gunfight while my girlfriend's standing over there. That's what a child playing cowboys and Indians would do, not what a man who cares about his obligations would do, yeah. And so then, yeah, he kills him, he kills the bodyguards, he kills just about everybody, and including his girlfriend, certainly chocolate death, up to his credit as well. And then he gets shot in the back by guy talk, which I also hated.
Charles:That development, for guy talks character, yeah, I mean, that whole episode was him being not particularly admirable, in my opinion. He figures out who's responsible for the robbery, because he saw the two guys at the mma fight the night before, or pie boxing, whatever it was, and and then he goes to his co-worker, who knows the guys, and brings it up in not a slick way at all. So it was very, it was completely transparent what was going on to the co-worker and the co-worker is like if you turn them in, you're killing me. You're killing them, you're killing all of us and it's like take, so take, fucking accountability. You. You killed yourselves the day you decided to show up in that shock with a gun and, to be fair, when you bonked me on the head, that's when you decided to kill yourself. So then Guy Cox decides I'm going to quit my job instead of turning them in.
Charles:I'll tell you, given the circumstance number one, I wouldn't have given the one guy any clues that I knew who his friends were. I would have gone straight to my boss or the police and been like hey, good news, I got this robbery solved, here's the guys that did it. And that would have been the end of the story and I would have had no. There's no talking me out of turning those guys in. Absolutely not. Turning those guys in, absolutely not. So I didn't like that. Gaita clumsily tried to play detective. I don't like that. He initiated the call to his manager and then went back on it because he thought he was being a nice guy. So question for you.
Charles:Yeah.
Dan:After his co-worker came to him and said listen, we're gonna die, you're gonna basically kill us if you turn us in. Do you still turn them in absolutely without? Yes, a hundred percent. So you're okay killing people, as long as it's not with a gun I did?
Charles:yeah, this is no trolley problem where, it's not this if you do something, yeah, that either directly leads to a death sentence or in a roundabout way, which that could have been bullshit anyway. The story of if you tell Curtis and you kill us. Really do I, or is that something that somebody will have trouble with? Well, I mean, so it's not his responsibility. The aggrieved, I agree, and suffering the consequences of their actions and their choices is not Guy Cox's fault.
Dan:But remember, you're sending them back to Russia and like they're having the war with Ukraine and who knows what kind of policies are going on over there in Russia for people who are leaving the country now, right? So I mean, I would think it's more likely that they would be somehow killed, either from the government or from from other people, because they get extradited, I guess yeah, they probably drifted into the war and then prison or like killed either way, yeah, it's like you know what.
Dan:Then too bad yeah, listen, I, if they're not innocent, I get it. Dude, trust me, I, I get, I'm just, I'm just.
Charles:There's just interesting thoughts here, because he shot the right, so like faces, and then they bonk him on the head to get away. It's like, no, you, you don't, you're, you're not among the people that I extend charity to. At that point, you, you gotta, you gotta deal with your actions, and it's not my job to save you from them. It's my job to do my job as a security guard, which is to bring the information of the robbery that happened at my job to the people that need to know it.
Dan:Okay. So then your job as a security guard is not to protect the owners of the hotel. It certainly is Okay.
Charles:So now that Am I not protecting anyone when he shot Rick in the unarmed? Rick in the back walking away with his dead girlfriend? Who's being protected in that scenario?
Dan:Okay, Fair, nobody Fair.
Charles:Murder Right.
Dan:Okay, murderer, right. Okay, even though it was direct command from the person who owned, like the woman won the hotel, said kill him. I said kill him. I tell you to kill somebody, dan, just because you want to work for you. So I mean, if you were to be a hot, a hefty, hefty minimum wage salary, I'm, I'm, I'm all about it. No, guy.
Charles:Guy guy talked about the character to see, no, to turn his eyes in for a crime. They get it is, but he doesn't have character to say I'm not gonna shoot him in in the back okay.
Dan:So what if he didn't shoot the kill and just like shot him in the leg? Would you be okay with that?
Charles:no, that's still. That's still not good, you don't. You don't? You don't use a gun against somebody. Yes, you want to kill them. Okay, it's not.
Dan:Yeah, you'll use a gun to disable somebody because it's funny because I was talking to my dad and they basically were saying my dad's like yeah, I didn't Same thing you did. I hated guy talk or how he changed characters, whatever and he shouldn't have killed him and he was okay with him, just shooting him in like in the leg to kind of wound him or whatever, but not actually kill him. So I was curious if that's If anything.
Charles:you're wet, you run up to Rick and pop him and pock him on the head with the butt of your gun and then restrain him.
Dan:That's a good point. Yeah, he was. I mean he was.
Charles:He was carrying your point. You shoot a gun as if you want to kill him, right, because, oh, I'll just shoot him in the leg, boom, hit his summer artery, he dies out. That's a good point. Or you miss his leg because it's hard to hit. It's hard to shoot somebody. You ain't for the tourists. Sorry, sure he did. Yeah, I, I did not like that guy, todd again, he was unwilling to turn in people who already committed a crime because of what might happen to them as a consequence.
Charles:But he's willing to now here's the thing, though, is guy todd didn't know that he was an art because he showed up late, but he was, he's, he's walking away carrying somebody yeah, I guess that's the point yeah, what looks like a dead or unconscious person with arms, okay, with his back to him. Yeah, and he yelled stop. And the guy didn't stop. So, yeah, that's when you, you gotta listen, you approach cautiously, you approach cautiously and then, yeah, train him, hit him in the head, do something. But yeah, yeah, because your boss tells you to shoot somebody. That doesn't give you license to shoot somebody in the back.
Dan:Well, I don't know what are the laws in Thailand.
Charles:That's a good question. I don't know, but it doesn't matter, it just gives something that is legal, obviously. Yeah, I get it.
Dan:I 100%.
Charles:I did not like it.
Dan:There are other ways to go about that situation.
Charles:And I mean White, did do a pretty good job of setting him up with, thanks to Mook's behavior. Yeah, great, that annoyed me so much. That was at the beginning, right when he's like he has her out for dinner that night, she's like I got to stay home with my mom. Well, what about tomorrow? Tomorrow night?
Dan:I'll think about it right, and that was after. That was after he said that he's thinking about quitting his job, correct?
Charles:yes, I've been in. I've been in that scenario of, basically, a girl says I'm not sure if I want to go out with you or not, and the correct answer is okay. Well, I don't want to put something else on your plate, so I withdraw the offer. If you want to go out with me, you can contact me and let me know, but I'm not. You have somebody out they give you and I'll think about it. My move is immediately withdraw the invitation, like I don't want to go out with somebody who has to think about it. I want to go out with somebody who's excited to go out with me. So if I get, oh, I'll think about it. Okay, you do that.
Dan:But the dynamic was for mine the whole dynamic, the whole show was was him.
Charles:She had the power and she. He was basically like begging for breadcrumbs correct, and and if she's into him now that he's a murderer, then fine, good luck. Let them have each other. That's what it takes to. Yeah, I mean compromise. The most important values you have is what gets you the girl you want. Then you deserve each other.
Dan:Yeah, it looks cool looking cool driving the owner away, and mook is in the background, all proud and and clearly excited by him yeah, I didn't, I didn't feel, I didn't think that that felt real and look, look.
Charles:And the other thing is I mean just based on stuff we've talked about for all the show if, if you get the girl by pretending to be a badass that you're not, then whenever a bigger badass comes along, she's going to be more interested in him than you. I mean right, I mean that's based on the way she talked about violence and ambition for the whole series.
Dan:Yeah, if it's some more violent, more ambitious guy comes along, guy talks a lot at least that's the way it looks to me and and he already picked up on that the very beginning of the season, when she was talking to those two body guards, and she's just like, oh, what they're nice.
Charles:And he's like they're a little not so nice or arrogant, and she just but you're right that was one of the first moves of him that I didn't care, or is that I'll try to bring this guy down, to bring myself up like that's not what? That's not what, somebody who's competent which they both claimed he was competent in this episode I don't think he was. I am confident like that's not a conversation that confident people have right, yeah, well.
Dan:He said well, no, but he said I'm confident when I feel good about myself and, and, and that's when he was.
Charles:He was saying which I give him credit for well, that's a true statement. That is not I.
Dan:I would never, even if I felt I would not share that with the girl who's a true, whose attention I was seeking so I give him credit for having the balls to say that, but to say hey, I mean, I give him credit for basically saying this job isn't for me, even though I've put my time and my years into it, knowing that she is attracted to the exact opposite of what he's now telling her. He had the balls to tell her that and then she's like well, I thought you were confident and he goes. Well, I am confident when I feel good about myself, so I gave him tons of credit there. However, that all got unwound when he gave in to basically shooting, shooting rick and and falling into the trap of being something that he really doesn't want to be, because he's like the buddha, wouldn't approve of of any type of violence, whether it's in self-defense or not, and she's like the Buddha, so she's totally on a different page he calls to engage in fore-dating strategy.
Charles:That's the way he was doing. Well, I don't think he was. Yeah, I don't. A little declaration of I'm confident when I feel good about myself.
Dan:Yeah, I mean that was. I don't think that was his strategy.
Charles:Allow me to have a positive self-image, then I'm confident. That's not what a competent 100 percent.
Dan:But I don't even wish he was right, but that wasn't his dating strategy at the time. I think he was actually being true to himself in that moment. And then the dating strategy.
Charles:Damn his dating strategy.
Dan:His dating strategy was I'm going to keep asking you and trying to sell you on this first date and dinner and and tell you about all these good things, which wasn't a great strategy anyway, but I don't think he was thinking dating strategy when he was. Basically, he finally said look, this job isn't for me.
Charles:Maybe he wasn't you know I don't think he's trying to out himself, but I still don't like it because, okay, I mean like oh, hey, I understand you like confident guys. Well, I've got good news for you. When circumstances allow me to feel good about myself, I'm real confident. What? So you're not confident because you don't right, you're good about yourself all that hive. So you're not confident all the time. So that's not confident right?
Charles:no, but what he was saying was when I feel good about myself, I get to pretend like I. No, what he was saying was when I feel good about myself, I get to pretend like.
Dan:I'm confident. Well, what he was saying was he was being vulnerable. He's like I don't feel good about myself in this job. This is not for me, and that's when she's just like what do you mean? Like you put time into this, you've got experience. Who cares what the Buddha says? And so I think I don't like that level of disclosure.
Charles:Those are all internal conversations that a guy should be having with himself to become the man he wants to be. And so you've never. I see I think it was dating. That's the thing. I think it was dating strategy. I think all the stuff he's telling her is part of his sales pitch to why she should want to be with him.
Dan:Okay, I can see that, while it may be true, because he does want to be confident.
Charles:It's part of the pitch. Okay, I can see that.
Dan:I can see that, yeah but I give him credit for at least being honest about himself and not trying to pretend like he was this brave security guard who protected the, the compound from the, from the guard from from the robbers, remember. So at least this in this, in this instance, he was actually, I think, honest with her about how he was feeling. So, strategy or not, I'm not sure.
Charles:I mean, I do feel like, again, I I don't give people praise for communicating truths about yourself in the weakest possible way is seemingly suboptimal behavior. Okay, and I feel like that's what he did basically all season was anytime that he was communicating something about himself, he chose to do it in a way that was angry, weak and kind of whiny, instead of I mean, hey, I, I decided this job doesn't work for me anymore, so i'm'm going to quit and find another job. Oh, I thought you were ambitious, okay, yeah, I think a lot of that too. For me to be a lot more dismissive of the push track that she was giving him the whole season, because, honestly, I mean, I don't love using red pill buzzwords like shit test. So she was shit testing him for a good portion of the season, trying to see if she could poke him and find spots of weakness, and he's like, here they are, yeah, and I, I did not.
Dan:I did not care for him behaving that way and and I I can see that for sure I think a better move would have been to show and not tell yeah, right, go get that other job. Don't even you know, I'm saying just go get, go get another job. That actually gives you that confidence that you're looking for yeah and and right.
Charles:Looking to the girl that you want to date, marry or be with for your strategic career planning is not going to do you any favors in the strategic career planning or the dating the girl. It's going to be a mistake for both of those purposes. So don't, don't bounce your. I think I'm going to quit my job and stop having an income plan off of the girl you want to be with would you want to see either of those characters in the next season?
Charles:definitely not. No, I I've already decided who they are and I don't want to see anymore okay.
Dan:So who do you want to see the next season?
Charles:because they always have somebody linked, gary I want to see in the next season, because they always have somebody linked Gary. I want to see Gary slash, greg make it.
Dan:I just want to see that scene where Gary is standing there at the foot of the bed with his girlfriend sleeping with somebody else. Is that what you're excited about?
Charles:No, I don't know that I want to see any of these characters make it to the next season. Okay, I guess I'd like to keep him. If he's going to, I want to see him maintain the the gary kind of being sprinkled into every season and seeing what he's up to. But let's talk about the situation.
Charles:Uh, I hated the fact that belinda brought her son into this dangerous situation. Yeah, and the one character I thought that behaved in a way that they didn't earn, didn't make sense in the context, was like on a dime, she decides that she's the badass who's going to outmaneuver the murdering half billionaire. Like I'm going to walk away and then my son's going to come after me and then I'm going to tell him exactly how we're going to handle this guy. Like, she went from being I'm scared, I'm worried, I'm anxious, I don't know what this guy's going to do to me To, all of a sudden, just and look, maybe she has some backstory and some history where she's tougher than she looks. But you didn't give us any of that backstory. All you gave us was I'm scared, I'm anxious.
Dan:I think you said everything the rustling in the bushes, whatever the reptiles, the Nazis.
Charles:It was like, yeah, whatever reptiles the Nazis. It was like, yeah, and then all of a sudden I'm just gonna turn on a dime and become this master negotiator with this murderer. Yeah, I was a little bit model. That was a little bit of an under turned for her character and again, I hate the idea that a good mother is going to expose her son and let him participate in this extortion caper in any way whatsoever.
Dan:That's not what a good mother would do and and he seemed like a good son, like he's like squeaky clean, like I mean they both seemed a little too money-grubbing for me.
Charles:Toward the end I did not like the we're going to work this, I mean. Yeah, especially belinda in particular seemed 100 convinced that he definitely murdered his wife. Yeah, she was not ambiguous Now, like like you and me have been.
Charles:No, and she was like she was terrified for a life that she was going to get Correct Murder Right, and so you're going to you're going to mention this to your son. You're going to bring your son into the negotiation. You're going to show up at the guy's house with your son. You're going to show up at the guy's house with your son I mean a guy with 500 million dollars from the second they walked in to have this conversation. He could have disappeared both of them and they never would have been seen from or heard again and again.
Dan:If you wanted to make that happen, he has the money and the resources to make yeah, you know, what's interesting is why didn't she just say meet me in a public place, we'll discuss there, like right?
Charles:yeah, yeah, I. I think I did not like that development. I didn't believe it either. Her character. So that was the. That was the sloppiest part of the finale for me was that she, she turned into this art of the deal badass, I'm gonna. I'm gonna stick it to this guy. I'm gonna get what I, what I deserve out of him. That that was not consistent with anything near who she was for. The for the rest of the season and letting her son get involved with it. It's one thing. It's like I'm gonna keep this a secret. I haven't said a word to this. I haven't said a word to my son about this. My son doesn't know that I'm here somebody does, but not my son, so we'll handle this like a couple of adults bringing the son along I. It made it made me angry. That's. That's not what a mom who cares about her son does, and that's not what a woman who cares about the right thing does either.
Dan:It was that's good point, right, she's got. She's got the problem with the ethics of of him taking money, blood money, but yet she's not got no problem putting her, her actual blood up for money correct?
Charles:yeah, I didn't care for that. So yeah any other. Any other thoughts about the series as it, as it played out? You know, I think I don't, I don't. Let's see if they have a green lit another season.
Dan:I'm sure yeah, they did the day after they. They did green light.
Charles:That I know he wants to do it, they'll, they'll keep oh yeah, they did.
Dan:I think the day after this was released, I remember reading something online they, yeah, they're definitely doing I wonder, I wonder what year it probably is not going to be until what?
Charles:2026 or seven? I'm sure it's definitely not going to be this year no probably it'll be 26.
Dan:The early is maybe 27, maybe 28 yeah, I'd be curious to know when the filming starts, so it so. It's usually about a year or six months after filming starts that it airs Something like that, right, yeah?
Charles:usually depending on how many special effects let's see. White Lotus season four. Oh well, he's doing Survivor. You said Late 26 or early 27. For release or start shooting no for release.
Dan:Oh, okay, all right.
Charles:Filming is anticipated to begin in 2026. So, if they film in early 2026. And early Late, 26 or early 27. Because, yeah, there's not a lot of CGI in a show like this that they have to spend a lot of time on.
Dan:So I think, as we have to put on the calendar as every week, we should do the episode right after. Do a lot as it comes out, or we could even, and then maybe come back at the end and go, okay, do a summary at the end after we know the whole story.
Charles:I'd love to do that. I could even watch it live.
Dan:Dude, let's do it Broadcast. That would be amazing. I would love to do that.
Charles:I don't know. You think I'll still be alive early 2027?
Dan:It's a gamble? I don't know.
Charles:All right, so we're done with the White Lotus season three, or it's done with us. However, you want to say it and we'll move on to. I think we should do popular media again. Sure, I enjoyed it. I really enjoyed it too. Take a break from we'll go back to a book we're going to do, let them right by Mel Robbins. Yeah, so we'll do that next and try to keep it around eight episodes. I don't want to make the series too long or too short, but I'll recommend for how many episodes we should do on Let them. I haven't started listening to it yet. You're already done right, I did.
Dan:I'm definitely going to need to re-listen to it. What do you give it out of five stars? I give it like four and a half or have a five yeah, I mean also mel robbins, very easy to listen to for me okay very entertaining and and I like the way she summarizes things too. So she's entertaining, she's easy to listen to. I think she's funny and she's she. She takes a lot of the, the science and stuff, distills it down and then puts it into plain language, and I really appreciate that.
Charles:Okay cool, I'm looking forward to starting. So yeah, next time you hear from us, we'll be talking about Mel Robbins and her bestselling. I mean it was quite a blockbuster. A lot of people are reading it, a lot of people are talking about it, so we'll we'll number among them. Thanks for listening to the entire episode and for joining us through this journey to the White Lotus season three. We had a great time breaking down these characters, their choices and what it says about masculinity in the modern world. We'll be back next week with a new series diving into the let them theory by Mel Robbins, so stay tuned for that, and in the meantime, you can find full audio and video episodes as anything else that we're up to at mindfullymasculinecom. Take care and we'll talk to you next.
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