Mindfully Masculine: Personal Growth and Mental Health for Men
Charles and Dan are just two guys talking about relationships, masculinity, and authenticity. Join them as they discuss books and media, as well as their (sometimes messy) personal stories, to encourage men to join the fight for their mental, physical, and emotional health--because a world of healthy, resilient men is a thriving and more secure world for everyone.
Mindfully Masculine: Personal Growth and Mental Health for Men
The Let Them Theory: Clarity or Cope?
In this episode of Mindfully Masculine, Charles dives into Chapters 1 and 2 of The Let Them Theory by Mel Robbins—and let’s just say, it gets heated early.
From micromanaging her son’s prom to being left off a girls’ trip, Mel lays out the moments that inspired her viral advice: “Let them.” But is it personal growth… or just a new way to dodge accountability?
Charles pulls no punches, questioning whether Mel’s stories reflect real insight or just strategic rebranding. Along the way, he explores control, shame spirals, friendship dynamics, and why some of us might not get invited to the party (and maybe shouldn’t).
You’ll hear:
– Why that prom corsage story is driving Charles up a wall
– The missing middle ground between shame and detachment
– How “let them” might become emotional bypassing without the right reflection
– Dan’s personal connection to the control struggle—and what he wishes he’d heard sooner
– A brutally honest take on whether The Let Them Theory is a breakthrough or just good marketing
Whether you’re a control freak in recovery or just wondering why you didn’t get that group text, this one’s for you.
Next up: Chapters 3 and 4—where stress, control, and identity collide.
From the first two chapters of this book. I don't like her at all what's not to like. Well for you. The first story that she tells in chapter one ha about micromanaging her son's prom experience made me insane. Like what is wrong with this woman.
Dan:Okay.
Charles:Welcome to the Mindfully Masculine Podcast. This is Charles, and today Dan and I are diving into the Let them Theory by Mel Robbins. We're starting with chapters 1 and 2, where Mel micromanages her son's prom, gets left out of a girls' trip and somehow decides that this all adds up to a self-help book. I've got thoughts, strong ones. Dan's here to defend her, or at least try and we're unpacking what it really means to let them, without becoming a doormat or a control freak. If you've ever been left off the group text and wondered was it me? This episode's for you. Check out mindfullymaskingcom to find full audio and video episodes and anything else we got going on. Thanks and enjoy. First episode discussing the let them carry by mel robbins. Have you read this whole book? Okay, I'm not. Yeah, you know how I frequently mention that the wise nobody told me this before is our only book where I've not jumped in with a bunch of criticism. Uh-huh, it remains alone okay, all right, I'm.
Charles:I'm curious to hear. All right, is this a lot of these first two chapters? Man, I would you describe mel robbins as likable, unlikable or somewhere in the middle I, I like her very much.
Dan:she I and I appreciate the way she breaks down concepts and makes them actionable. She tells good stories. She bases a lot of her information on people who are smarter than she is in scientific research, so, but I'm pretty familiar with a lot of her work already. So that's I definitely. I definitely appreciate her, yeah.
Charles:From her interviews I've seen and shorter clips on YouTube. I like her from the first two chapters of this book. I don't like her at all.
Dan:What's not to like?
Charles:Well, for you the first.
Charles:the first story that she tells in chapter one, hot about micromanaging her son's prom experience, may be insane, Like what is wrong with this woman okay so the big thing was she either picked out or created or bought or something, a corsage for her son's date, even though he said not to, even though he said not to, and then when it's time to, I guess drop him off or bring him to prom or whatever, even like the night of he again told her not to. So she slips it in her purse and brings it with her anyway just in case just in case, right yeah.
Charles:And springs it onto the girl. And this isn't his long time girlfriend, this is a girl he's just asked to prom, he knows, wow. And she springs out like oh, I brought this just in case.
Dan:And the kicker was she had made, the girl had made her own, yeah, and she was so nice that she ended up saying, oh, I'll wear it anyway, right, and at that point Mel, mel didn't feel good about that, if you remember. She, she recognized. Okay, she made a mistake there.
Charles:Yeah, I mean, you don't get points for feeling bad about something that people have warned you not to do and you did it anyway, right, and then it has a terrible result and then you feel bad afterward. Listen, yeah. So then fast forward to chapter two. She's telling this story about all of her girlfriends get together and go on this girl's trip and at first she just notices a friend is on a trip and she's like, oh, that looks like fun. And then she starts going through the post and seeing that a lot of her friends are on this trip together and she's not. Yep, you know.
Charles:Then she gets into the. Well, they want to go on a trip without me? Let them, that's fine, they can do that. They're allowed to blah, blah, blah.
Charles:And then she in the in chapter two it's like and then let me, let me realize that, okay, I haven't really kept in touch with these people, I haven't invested in the friendship, so maybe they didn't even think of me. So they didn't think, they didn't decide to exclude me, they just didn't. I didn't occur to them because I haven't been investing into my friendships with them and my my reaction to that is oh, wait a second, maybe they did think of you. Maybe they didn't want the woman who insists on bringing the corsage to her son's cross. I'll take this on my I get it.
Charles:You and a bunch of our mutual friends got together and said, boy, it'd be really nice to go on a really chill, relaxing vacation where we can stay out late and dance and not have a bunch of political conversations and getting into fights about whether this senator should have done this or this president should have done that. That's going to be a really chill, relaxing time. I'm really looking forward to it. And somebody's like hey, should we invite Charles? And the reaction was did you not hear me describe the kind of vacation that I'm looking for?
Dan:Yeah right.
Charles:No, if we want this kind of vacation, the last person we want is Charles.
Dan:Yeah.
Charles:And then I heard about it or I saw a post about it, I'd be like, yeah, that makes sense. I get where they're coming from, but from where I'm at in this book, so far she has not done any of the connecting of the dots to say, okay, maybe the way I show up to my friendships or my son's prom is the reason that my friends decide let's not invite Mel if we want to have a good time.
Charles:Mm-hmm, yeah yeah. Those two stories together. So far she has not taken any ownership of the way I show up to my relationships. Might be the reason people don't invite me on group trips.
Dan:And you left out the other part of the problem, when her son had just bought brand new sneakers and wanted to go to.
Charles:So it was radio Years of the tuxedo. I hate the sun now too Right, well, oakley. I hate the sun now too Right, well, oakley. This game is Oakley.
Dan:Okay. So, as he's known by Mel in this part, he wanted to go to also this really popular taco place where there's not a lot of people. They didn't make any reservations. They didn't make any reservations and there's like 20 of them. Like all these kids are like putting them.
Dan:He says they have it's a taco stand with like four tables right and and it's raining out and she's just like here grabbing, she's trying to give them umbrellas, she's trying to help. All the parents are all freaking out and she's like we need to make reservations for them at a real place where they've got plenty of room and her daughter, kendall, goes let them. It's not your prom mom, it's's theirs. Let them do that. So she finally let go. That was the whole inspiration of the book. She finally let go and it's like all right, you're right, I'll let them do that. I'll let her ruin her shoes, I'll let them get soaked in the rain, I'll let them wait outside and not get food. She like let go.
Dan:And that was the whole purpose of writing this book. Was that's the lesson she learned. She ended up giving him 40 bucks and said have a good time. He lit up, they had a good time, he ruined his shoes and she was okay with it. So that was really an important lesson for her to learn at that point. So I think you'll, you'll, you'll, I'm not going to plant anything, or too late, I guess, but I, I think, I think you'll realize that she does realize the errors of her ways.
Charles:Yeah, yeah, but I mean what look? I mean, I'm not. I'll be doing a podcast, so I don't get to be on this book at the beginning but, I think other people I think you do, because it's your podcast.
Charles:If you want to do, you could. I think other people may may see the way that she is addressing some of these things and like look, if, if you find out that your friends have just gone on a vacation and they invite you to go along with them, you have a few choices for how you can react to that. You get the act of that by saying, okay, I'm a huge piece of shit, everybody hates me, that's why they didn't invite me. Boohoo, I'm the worst, yada yada. You could do that. Or you could say, oh, this doesn't affect me at all, they choose to have a vacation without me that has zero percent to do with me.
Charles:That has nothing to do with me whatsoever. That's their choice and that's completely fine. They can do that if they want to. It doesn't matter to me, yeah. Or you can be somewhere in the middle that says, okay, yes, they're allowed to go on a vacation without me. That doesn't make them bad people. That doesn't make me a bad person.
Charles:However, what about? The way I show up to? These friendships may lead them to make the decision of? This might be more fun or just easier. If we don't ask her and it doesn't seem like she that's a possibility she's only referenced the two extremes so far in chapters one and two of either I go into a shame spiral because they didn't invite me along, or they didn't invite me along has nothing to do with me. That's just a decision they made. Where it seems like truth lives in the gray area in the middle, which is, yeah, they're allowed to not invite you along, but the decision to not invite you could have a lot to do with the way you chose. You choose to show up like the way you choose to micromanage your son's products.
Dan:Right, right, so have there been. I mean, I know, when I was younger there were a lot of moments where I could, if I could go back, I would have told myself, let them do that that's okay. Any anything come to mind for you where you would have wanted to go back and go, hey good question.
Charles:Yes, I yeah, I think so I think, I think there have been some situations like that, and I'm not saying there's not value to be had in this book. I'm sure that there is, and I'm sure that I'm going to stumble upon things that I really do appreciate and I can get some good stuff out of and that we can then pass along to our audience. However, one of the other things that bother me is she talks about discovering this. Let them e.
Dan:Okay.
Charles:Yeah, either give me the name of the person you got it from or admit that you made it up. You didn't discover this. Let them theory.
Dan:Well, I think what she claims was it came to her when her daughter, kendall, told her about the son and his prom. Let them like, let them fuck up their shoes, let them go in the rain, let them starve and wait online at the taco place. That's, that was. That was what she's claiming as the discovery.
Charles:So yeah, there's somebody else out there who's claiming that she stole this idea from them. Oh really, yeah who is? That it's a poet, a real poem. All about a poem called I, I think, called Letna, about letting people make their own decisions, their own choices.
Dan:I mean.
Charles:I mean listen, yeah, I mean, with the way the publishing industry works again, I'm not saying there's not good stuff in here, yeah, this feels to me like somebody came up with a title that could sell some books and now, all right, we got the title that's going to work, we've got the title that's going to move products, so now let's write the book around it. And I think that's what she did, because it started as like a social media post and I think her, or somebody that works for her or with her, decided okay, this is a cash cow, now it's time to milk it, I mean.
Dan:But there's good value in it. There's good stuff. I definitely got a lot of really good stuff out of it A lot of practical ways to think about situations where you're feeling left out, when you're feeling that something is out of your control, and you don't like it.
Dan:So I know, for me personally, I have tried to control other people and other things a lot in my life, like specifically, probably around eating, like with my family, I've basically. But I know where that comes from and it comes from me. I want the best for them, I want them to be healthy. For me it's most it's probably an overreaction because I'm being a type. I'm being a type one diabetic. Things affect me a lot more than an average person who grows not right.
Dan:So I have that built in me and it was also imposed on me and thankfully in a very strong way from my family and my doctors when I was really young so that I could be as healthy as possible, and it was in the vein of caring and so I kind of picked up that trait.
Dan:And as an adult, I've definitely overstepped my bounds at times with my family and other people sometimes where I've probably tried to control what they're eating and in terms of made them feel bad about certain things or giving them information they didn't ask for Right, made them feel bad about certain things or given them information they didn't ask for Right. So for me, I really could have used the let them theory back then and when I was doing that more often, to just let them let. Let them, let them make those choices, let them eat. For me, a lot of this is I translate this into letting other people stop trying to control their people and and let them make the choices that they want to make Right, unless they're going to hurt themselves or somebody else. I think it's a good way to go about it.
Charles:Yeah, but that's where it gets kind of tricky, because it's very easy for you to tell yourself the story of I have to intervene because they are going there.
Dan:And that's exactly what I was saying oh my God, you can't eat all that candy, you're going to be killing yourself, kind of thing. I mean, being a type 1 diabetic is survival, but they're not.
Dan:Right but they're not Survival Right, but that's an excuse because they are not Right. And even if I eat all that candy, that's not going to kill me. It's not good for me. It's not going to kill me. For me it's like my blood sugar was too low. It goes too high. Nobody dies from too high of a blood sugar Over time. It's a slow death, but you know so. For me a lot of this came into yeah, stop trying to control the uncontrollable, which is other people right, and that's I mean.
Charles:That is the recipe for a miserable life, right? If you all it, if you spend all your time trying to control things that cannot be controlled it's like banging your head against the wall.
Dan:I mean, come on, yeah, bang your head against the wall.
Charles:I mean, come on, yeah, banging your head against the wall or just digging a hole in your yard and then filling it up, and then digging the hole and then filling it up, it might do. Just you're doing it, you need nothing done, and you're spending all this time and effort on no result to show for it. And so, yeah, and that's not. That's certainly not a concept she, she's discovered. I mean buddhism, stoicism. There's, there's plenty of isms that have come upon this idea of yeah, if you, if you invest all your time in trying to manage the unmanageable, then you're, you're going to just be miserable constantly. And yeah, there there is. There is value in saying people are going to do what people are going to do, and it's not my job to prevent them or control it or even guide them or help them. It's, it's our job to give people the dignity of their own choices, and then we can decide which people we want in our lives, based on those free choices that they're allowed to make yeah, I know, I mean, I mean, I know.
Dan:A lot of times my I've shown when I care about somebody through trying to control them.
Charles:Yeah, Right, yeah, yeah.
Dan:And and that's not like oh. I know what's best kind of thing, and it's like, even if you do or even if you've been proven right, it's, it's just not the method to go about helping somebody or showing their care for them.
Charles:So I, yeah, that's. I mean it's. It's a difficult position to be in when, especially when you see somebody making choices like you know oh, I've been in your position, I've made the wrong choice you were about to make. It's over the consequences, I've enjoyed the benefits of making the right choice where you are right now and now I'm just going to stay quiet and watch and see what you do. That is a difficult position to be in, yeah.
Dan:Well, I think I don't know if it was you or somebody else, I heard that from which was a good way to approach, that is, to just offer them the suggestion that, hey, I've I've experienced something similar before, and just kind of put that out there and see if they bite and say, oh, okay, well, what did you do, right? Allow them then to say, oh, I do want advice, like or no, I don't need it, I'm good, right, yeah.
Charles:And I mean. The problem with that that I've experienced too, is have you, if you set your entire relationship with someone conditioning them so that when you ask them if they want your advice, they feel like they have no choice but to say yes and yeah, if you're not really giving them the choice that it feels like you're giving, yeah?
Dan:Yeah, I think a lot of that has to do also no-transcript, but to sit down and eat, yeah, and it's still their choice. But it's still their choice. I mean, I mean you, yeah, but you, you're right, you may have trained them is better.
Charles:The first in the first way, of just telling them what to do, whether they want to hear it or not. Yeah, but it's still not optimal. So, all right, let's pause for a second. I got to pee.
Dan:Oh yeah, all right, no problem.
Charles:Yeah. So the thing I wanted to see a little bit more, or hear more from her and I hope I do in the in the rest of the book is whenever you're in a circumstance where someone is giving you treatment that you find uncomfortable or undesirable. I think that healthy and effective people do ask the question of okay, how have I contributed? Or, to use the recent now, how have I set the table for the easiest choice they could make to be Let me exclude Charles or let me work. Charles isn't, let me not invite Charles because because of how, how he is or how he is showing up and again, I don't think this I don't think the solution is to ruminate on that or to obsess over it or to feel terrible about yourself. Yeah, you know, if you do get ghosted, if you do get broken up with, if your friends go on a trip without inviting you, there is a portion of that again that I think healthy, effective people do, where they say, okay, this thing's a little bit, yeah, what might I have done, what part might I have played in this result that I'm feeling uncomfortable about? Yeah, and so far, like I said, she seemed to in the first two chapters at least, she's hit the extremes of either going into a shame spiral.
Charles:I'm a terrible person, I'm a piece of shit. That's why they did that. That's why they treated me this way to oh, they won't treat me that way they can treat. That's why they treated me this way to oh, they won't treat me that way. They can treat me that way. That's fine. That's up to them. They can just do that. It has to do with them. It doesn't have to do with me. Where I want to see an approach in the middle where you're taking some accountability and some responsibility for, yeah, this situation. That's not reality.
Dan:There is some sort of most, there is most likely some part of some part of this that you did contribute to, and you need to at least recognize it and realize what that is and not just kind of put your head in the sand Cause a lot of times, like when I first read let them, I thought, oh, it's fuck them, right Like. I thought, oh, it's me Fuck them, right, like, like, right, like, like all right, all right. And so that was my first reaction when I heard that. And then I speak of a book with a tie down the title of the book. Here we go.
Dan:So and she does start to touch on that Is that there is something else that's needed because, yeah, it can lead you to a feeling of superiority and also isolation. So, basically, you forget if you're telling them, oh well, let them go ahead, let them, let them it. And at times throughout life when I've done that, yeah, it's, it's made me feel good in the moment, because I'm able to then feel like release that anxiety and that like from from blaming myself to blaming somebody else, and that always feels good, you know, and but, but it doesn't last very long because you're like, well, I'm still not, like I'm still upset about the situation. Like longer term it doesn't resolve anything.
Charles:Yes, in fact, I thought of an example of this. And get a little political here. If you do the let them, without the let me, the only people left in your life are going to be, yes, men and sycophants.
Dan:Mm-hmm yeah.
Charles:I think we can see that in some examples in our own government. Yeah For sure, If your attitude is, I am never going to admit to not knowing something. I'm never going to admit to meeting experts who understand things I don't understand. To fill me in, I'm just going to say this is the line and you pair it the party line, or else you're out of here. And then all of a sudden, any of the experts who might disagree with you, they work their way out of your inner circle and all you get surrounding you are people that agree with you and tell you what you want to hear. It surrounding you are people that agree with you and tell you what you want to hear, and I would almost argue that being surrounded by people like that is more lonely than just being alone well, see, here's the thing.
Dan:It's like social media, does that? Too, but all, but the social media does that too. It feeds you what you're interested in and and to support you whatever.
Charles:So, if anything, and that could be why so many people who are obsessed with social media feel so bad about themselves all the time because maybe you bring all the years of a quick fix right.
Dan:It's a quick, it's a quick dopamine hit, but it's like long-term it's not going to build, I feel, a level of fulfillment.
Charles:So the let me part, which she didn't really she spent more time on let them in the first chapter than she did on let me in the second chapter yeah, and so I'm anxious to hear more about the let me theory and exactly what that means to her and how she structures it.
Charles:Yeah, I feel like and I've experienced the end of relationships before where I've taken the approach of this is a hundred percent my fault and so I feel terrible about it, and the other side of this is a hundred percent their fault, so I feel cold and dead about it.
Charles:Right, and neither one of those is a reflection of reality, and so neither one of those gives you the opportunity to feel like, okay, this is hard, but I've moved forward. Yeah, to feel like, okay, this is hard, but I've moved forward, like you don't get that feeling from either of those approaches of either it's all their fault or it's all my fault. The only way that you can look at it and and build upon your own health and your own wellbeing is to say, okay, this person and I built this relationship that eventually failed together and we both played a role in making it into something that was not sustainable. I gotta learn about the parts that I brought to this relationship that didn't help it, hurt it instead. I've got to learn about the things that I was attracted to in this other person that they brought that turned out to be not sustainable as well, and then I can move forward and hope to build on this foundation for my next relationship.
Charles:But if you take an all or nothing approach to your personal responsibility, oh well, yeah, I mean whether that's getting fired from a job, whether it's getting broke up, whatever it is. If you take on the, either it was all my fault or this had nothing to do with me. Neither of them were based in reality, Correct Absolutely, and so you're not going to be able to build on that to have anything valuable in the future no, because you're going to be building off of a false pretense, if anything, if you're going to build at all from that exactly.
Charles:You're on a shaky foundation, and so that that was my only concern and again, I'm open to the possibility this is all stuff that I'm bringing into this book. That she's not saying, but it did feel like the. The way she talked herself out of feeling bad about her friends going on the trip. I mean she immediately went to well, it's because I'm a workaholic, and the whole.
Charles:I don't have the things in life because I'm a workaholic is a little bit of a humble brag. You're better about yourself, it's not. I don't have the friendships that I want because I'm a shitty friend and I'm annoying to people. Like I can't set aside these awkward tendencies that make people uncomfortable. It's a lot easier to say it's because I'm working, I take my career too seriously. You know what I mean if you have to make an excuse like I have good friends, I work too hard and I value my career too much, or I spend too much time focusing on my family, so I neglect my friendships. So like, all right, these are good ways to get yourself out of feeling a little bit of pressure.
Dan:So, if you remember she does talk about these people were friends where she was probably in full annoyance mode, like when she was younger, because she said, I knew them from, we raised our kids together, we had gone on, we spent weekends together, we had gone on double dates with our partners together, things like that. Right, so that was even before she discovered the let them theory. So she was probably in her full controlling crazy mode and they were still friends with her at that point. Okay, so I think she might be right in terms of just, she hasn't put her time and effort into the friendship. They already knew how annoying she was, according to you According to you, that's how I'm thinking it anyways Because they full well know her personality. You know, back to our last series.
Charles:I'm thinking of Mel as the fourth friend on White Lotus that didn't get invited to go to Thailand, the three women who, at different points, were all kind of annoying in their own way. Oh sure, yeah, I'm imagining her as the fourth one who didn't even get there. Oh my God.
Dan:Well, it's because she's a hard worker and she's been working. She's a workaholic so they knew she wouldn't have the time, so that's why she didn't go.
Charles:Yeah, so anyway, sorry, I'm hoping that we can. The other thing I didn't like was the seesaw analogy.
Dan:Okay.
Charles:If you just do let them, then you find yourself up in the air looking down on your friends Right, are looking down on your friends right and the let me I get. The implication is, I guess, with let them plus let me, you find yourself more in an equilibrium. But I don't know. I guess yeah, if you're at the bottom of the seesaw looking up, as you taking a hundred percent responsibility for every bad thing that happens, and if you're on the seesaw looking down, that's you taking 0%. And so in the middle you're at 50-50 or some realistic number, where this is partly my fault, partly their choice.
Charles:I didn't feel like she really completed the circle on that analogy, to say she only talked about being at the top or being at the bottom, and your relationships with other people are not a zero-sum game where there has to be a winner and there has to be a loser, yeah. And I didn't feel like she really addressed the equilibrium where you can figure out a way to conduct your relationships where either one of you is at the top, yeah, and either one of you is butt on the ground, right. There's a way to be in the middle, and I didn't think she spent enough time drilling that.
Dan:No, we only we're only two chapters in.
Charles:Fair enough. Yeah, give her, give her a little more time. I hope she re-isits some of these things in a little bit more detail, but the seesaw analogy did not, just didn't ring true for me. Okay, so in chapters think three and four is what we're going to hit next, and that's where we talk a little bit about the stress you have in your life as a result of your need to control, which, look, I'm. I'm looking for a book that tells me how I can let go of my impulse to control everything, because control does real. Control brings safety, and the illusion of control brings chaos, because at some point you're gonna be confronted with the fact that you're not in control of the things you think they're in control of.
Dan:Yeah.
Charles:And how do you deal with that? Yeah, yeah. And how do you deal with the shift of? Okay, these are the things that I think I'm in control of and then, boom, surprise, you weren't really this whole time. You thought you were in control, you weren't in control.
Dan:Now, now, what are you gonna do? And that can be a painful realization to experience. Yeah, yeah, that's, that's uh, I'm interested to. I forget exactly if she gets into that. I'm sure she does, because that's a pretty much that's totally coming up already in our minds just from the first two chapters.
Charles:MPU's exposure and experience with stoic philosophy too is, at some point, if you insist on living this life where you're trying to control things that are uncontrollable, the fact that something is in reality not controllable it's not going to come as a gentle whisper, it's going to be a brick that hits you in the head.
Dan:It can if, yeah, yeah, if you are clutching onto that control, right, if you don't realize it on your own, I think, I think, right, it's kind of. It's kind of one of those things where, right, like uh, with mice and men, where lenny is holding the, the bird or whatever, and then, or when it was a mouse or a bird mouse, whatever, yeah, it ends up like, instead of holding it gently, right, he ends up crushing it, kind of thing, right, same, same kind of constant for me, and for me as a control freak and I'm probably speaking for some other control freaks out there the subtle little hints that hey, you might not be in control of this, we just ignore, that, we just derail right over.
Charles:It's only when we're confronted with evidence that we cannot deny that it says hey, idiot, you thought you were in control of this. Surprised you never were. That's the only time, at least for me, that it really hits home and I realized okay, I was not in control of this. I've got room for improvement in these areas and I'm hoping that Mel Robbins shows me some stuff that I-.
Dan:Listen, I think we all do. I think we all go through phases of being controlling and trying to control things that we can't and people that we can't obviously control. I mean, I think, I think it's human nature, I don't think it's. Yeah, it probably, I think, exerts itself in more in some people than others, right? I? I think for me, and I think the reason why this book was so popular is because everybody has those moments where we're just trying to control what is futile yeah, yeah, I think so too.
Charles:Yeah, all right, well, so we will pick up with the next couple of chapters next week, and I'm looking forward to seeing how how it feels to keep going through it you too all right, all right, thanks, dan we'll stop it there. All right, bye-bye. Okay, that's it for this episode of mindfully masculine. We'll be back next week with chapters three and four of the let them theory, where mel starts connecting some dots between control, stress and what it's actually costing you. Thanks for listening and we'll talk to you then.
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